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Downton gone!

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johnson said:
:lol:

That was the most meaningless stat known to man, how is better than both, in the last 2 years of his career both scored more than him at a better rate, as did Trott and Cook
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The last two years? What about all the other years? If Pietersen makes a return he will automatically be our best bat.
 

KGC83 said:
KP was our top run scorer in the last series he played. Whatever way you want to look at it Pietersen is better than both Bell and Root.
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Spot on - it was incredible that they decided to point the finger at the top run scorer. Being the best of a bad bunch is still being the best of that bunch.

It's also not just the number of runs he can score - it's the way he plays and his aggressive attitude. The Aussies will come over here all guns blazing - with the bat they will be very positive and with the ball they will be trying to knock the England batsmens' heads off. A middle order of Ballance, Root, Bell just screams "come and get us". It's very unlikely any of those players will be able to seize the initiative back. It will just be about survival.
 
KGC83 said:
The last two years? What about all the other years? If Pietersen makes a return he will automatically be our best bat.
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You are just basing that on nothing, the most recent years are the most relevant

I couldn't give a shit how good he was 5 years ago, he will automatically be our best bat? Based on what? School holidays is it?

Sweeper said:
Spot on - it was incredible that they decided to point the finger at the top run scorer. Being the best of a bad bunch is still being the best of that bunch.

It's also not just the number of runs he can score - it's the way he plays and his aggressive attitude. The Aussies will come over here all guns blazing - with the bat they will be very positive and with the ball they will be trying to knock the England batsmens' heads off. A middle order of Ballance, Root, Bell just screams "come and get us". It's very unlikely any of those players will be able to seize the initiative back. It will just be about survival.
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Such a shit point, even KP's biggest fans aren't saying he will automtically be our best batsmen, well he wasn't in the years before he got sacked was he

Bell for starters was the main reason we won the Ashes at home, he was absolutely unbelievable, but I take it that has just been forgotten as it doesn't fit in with your agenda.

The second point you make is better and most logical, we might need someone with a different tempo, but just to say he is our best batsmen isn't true, because he wasn't when he got sacked, getting a few more runs in a shite series doesn't reflect that, you need a bigger time period.
 
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johnson said:
You are just basing that on nothing, the most recent years are the most relevant

I couldn't give a shit how good he was 5 years ago, he will automatically be our best bat? Based on what? School holidays is it?
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He just is - it's absolutely clear as day that he is by far our best batsman. Whether or not he can score the runs he needs to in early season conditions remains to be seen, but with the exception of Cook, there is no other England batsman who can even make a case to be in his class bracket.

johnson said:
Such a shit point, even KP's biggest fans aren't saying he will automtically be our best batsmen, well he wasn't in the years before he got sacked was he

Bell for starters was the main reason we won the Ashes at home, he was absolutely unbelievable, but I take it that has just been forgotten as it doesn't fit in with your agenda.
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So Pietersen being the top run scorer in the last Ashes series is irrelevant, but Bell being the top run scorer in the one before that is? How the fuck does that work?!
 
Sweeper said:
He just is - it's absolutely clear as day that he is by far our best batsman. Whether or not he can score the runs he needs to in early season conditions remains to be seen, but with the exception of Cook, there is no other England batsman who can even make a case to be in his class bracket.
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Based on what? about 4 years ago he was, but he hasn't been since then, and the records prove it.

Sweeper said:
He just is - it's absolutely clear as day that he is by far our best batsman. Whether or not he can score the runs he needs to in early season conditions remains to be seen, but with the exception of Cook, there is no other England batsman who can even make a case to be in his class bracket.



So Pietersen being the top run scorer in the last Ashes series is irrelevant, but Bell being the top run scorer in the one before that is? How the fuck does that work?!
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Because Bell got about 4 hundreds, KP did fuck all, he was shocking in that Ashes series as they all were

You need a bigger time frame and take their records over a few years, as I have already pointed out, not just basing it on one series, where they were all shite.

I can't believe you are using the last Ashes series as a reason for him to be picked to be honest :lol:, embarrassing.

KP was fairly poor in the last 2 Ashes, at least Bell was good in one of them.


So basically you reason for KP being our best batsman is that he "Just Is"

Thanks for the insight mate.
 
johnson said:
I can't believe you are using the last Ashes series as a reason for him to be picked to be honest :lol:, embarrassing.
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OK then we'll look at a slightly longer period - in the year and a half before he became the most ridiculous of scapegoats, he scored test hundreds against Australia, South Africa, India and Sri Lanka. He was hardly shit. He is the top run scorer in English cricket history and the one person that the Australian bowlers might not actually be salivating at the prospect of bowling to.

He was cast off on the back of a series in which he was the best of a bad bunch, but still the best of them. We know now that the shit was already being collected during that series to be flung at him and deflect attention away from others - "disengaged etc etc". This having already proven himself to probably be the best English batsman of the modern era. How they came to that decision is absolutely beyond me - oh to be a fly on the wall in that selection meeting.

There's also the small fact that with the exception of an underwhelming series turn-around against a disinterested India last summer, the England set up has spent every waking day since his "sacking" being an out and out embarrassment.
 
Sweeper said:
OK then we'll look at a slightly longer period - in the year and a half before he became the most ridiculous of scapegoats, he scored test hundreds against Australia, South Africa, India and Sri Lanka. He was hardly shit. He is the top run scorer in English cricket history and the one person that the Australian bowlers might not actually be salivating at the prospect of bowling to.

He was cast off on the back of a series in which he was the best of a bad bunch, but still the best of them. We know now that the shit was already being collected during that series to be flung at him and deflect attention away from others - "disengaged etc etc". This having already proven himself to probably be the best English batsman of the modern era. How they came to that decision is absolutely beyond me - oh to be a fly on the wall in that selection meeting.
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I never said he should of been sacked, but he has a lot to prove again, I just don't agree that he instantly becomes our best batter when he is back in the side, he simply isn't based on the records over the last few years.

He is without doubt one of our best ever players, and his record matches that, but personally I would rather Bell and Root for the time being, with Stokes/Ali and Buttler in after them, plenty of runs there.

If you want KP in then no worries, entitled to your opinion, but it doesn't mean he becomes our best player again, would he perform again, probably. I just don't think he is worth the hassle anymore, he has fell out everywhere he has ever been.

If Bell or Root don't perform against Windies and NZ and KP has scored a shit load of runs, then he might deserve his chance, and he will have to take it.
 
johnson said:
I never said he should of been sacked, but he has a lot to prove again, I just don't agree that he instantly becomes our best batter when he is back in the side, he simply isn't based on the records over the last few years.

He is without doubt one of our best ever players, and his record matches that, but personally I would rather Bell and Root for the time being, with Stokes/Ali and Buttler in after them, plenty of runs there.

If you want KP in then no worries, entitled to your opinion, but it doesn't mean he becomes our best player again, would he perform again, probably. I just don't think he is worth the hassle anymore, he has fell out everywhere he has ever been.

If Bell or Root don't perform against Windies and NZ and KP has scored a shit load of runs, then he might deserve his chance, and he will have to take it.
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Therein lies the problem though - because of the way he's been treated, he isn't afforded the luxury of pointing at how many runs he milked a piss poor Indian medium pace attack for last year. When you think back to how easy batting was for England last summer though, it's not difficult to imagine the ridiculous number he probably would have racked up.
 
johnson said:
You are just basing that on nothing, the most recent years are the most relevant

I couldn't give a shit how good he was 5 years ago, he will automatically be our best bat? Based on what? School holidays is it
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There is nobody in our top order who has the ability to take the game away from the opposition in one session. That makes him our best bat imo. Oh and get fucked you condescending twat.
 
One thing that's also lost amongst all of this is his value to the Roots and Ballances of this world. When Australia's four quicks are limbering up and eyeing up a barrage of bouncers, and the likes of David Warner and Shane Watson are in their ears and calling them worse than shite, it might be nice for them to have someone in the dressing room that's done everything in the game; including maintaining a career test average against Australia over 50 regardless of the last series. Someone who won't just look to survive but will try to get after them. Who are they supposed to look to for inspiration when they're under the cosh? Bell has only recently shook off his Sherminator persona in Ashes cricket, Cook needs to sort his own game out before giving anyone elses any thought, and Trott is going to have more than a few demons to try and dispel.
 
Sweeper said:
Therein lies the problem though - because of the way he's been treated, he isn't afforded the luxury of pointing at how many runs he milked a piss poor Indian medium pace attack for last year. When you think back to how easy batting was for England last summer though, it's not difficult to imagine the ridiculous number he probably would have racked up.
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well he would of had to of improved his game against left arm spin for starters.

Sweeper said:
One thing that's also lost amongst all of this is his value to the Roots and Ballances of this world. When Australia's four quicks are limbering up and eyeing up a barrage of bouncers, and the likes of David Warner and Shane Watson are in their ears and calling them worse than shite, it might be nice for them to have someone in the dressing room that's done everything in the game; including maintaining a career test average against Australia over 50 regardless of the last series. Someone who won't just look to survive but will try to get after them. Who are they supposed to look to for inspiration when they're under the cosh? Bell has only recently shook off his Sherminator persona in Ashes cricket, Cook needs to sort his own game out before giving anyone elses any thought, and Trott is going to have more than a few demons to try and dispel.
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He still did though, that was a good a summer of batting by one player than I have ever seen. He really was the reason we won that Ashes. Don't discount it in the slightest mate, very unfair.
 
Sweeper said:
One thing that's also lost amongst all of this is his value to the Roots and Ballances of this world. When Australia's four quicks are limbering up and eyeing up a barrage of bouncers, and the likes of David Warner and Shane Watson are in their ears and calling them worse than shite, it might be nice for them to have someone in the dressing room that's done everything in the game; including maintaining a career test average against Australia over 50 regardless of the last series. Someone who won't just look to survive but will try to get after them. Who are they supposed to look to for inspiration when they're under the cosh? Bell has only recently shook off his Sherminator persona in Ashes cricket, Cook needs to sort his own game out before giving anyone elses any thought, and Trott is going to have more than a few demons to try and dispel.
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He averages 44.95 against Australia. Starc, Harris and Johnson will be a bit different to his big bash jolly. That's a menacing attack.
 
johnson said:
What?

He is playing against a university side you idiot, stop tagging me in shite.
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First class cricket still which you wanted him to play.
A motivated KP is going to make a lot of people look very silly and sit extremely uneasily in their lofty perches at the ECB!
 
Mrjardine said:
First class cricket still which you wanted him to play.
A motivated KP is going to make a lot of people look very silly and sit extremely uneasily in their lofty perches at the ECB!
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I couldn't give a shit mate, hope that helps.
 
Mrjardine said:
Yet you gave a shit when giving the bloke one lashing after another on here.
Lot of people going to have egg on faces come this summer.
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No they won't, he will score a shit load of runs in division 2, its hardly rocket science

I just don't like the twat

If you think you are going to change my mind on that you are totally wrong
 
johnson said:
No they won't, he will score a shit load of runs in division 2, its hardly rocket science

I just don't like the twat

If you think you are going to change my mind on that you are totally wrong
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Didn't moeen Ali get picked on the back of division two runs? And that was without the backup of being England's all time leading scorer!
If you don't think moores, Whittaker etc are dreading KP scoring heavily early summer you're being very naive.
I think I've just about got that you don't like him but it's not a popularity contest it's about winning international cricket matches as anybody who thinks having KP in the side doesn't improve those chances are letting personal feelings distort their opinions.
 
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