Dissent shouldn't be a sending off


You could say that on two different ways and get two different outcomes as an result
Not sure - from where I was sat quite close to where it happened he seemed to be making the point about how many incidents where Boro were playing well beyond the line and getting away with it

Saying “and that was a fcuking foul” seems to me to be making the point with emphasis - which was deserved I think

Obviously I could not hear what he said but the reaction of others seemed consistent with that

Presumably players can still appeal for free kicks? Is there a sending off difference between “that’s a foul Ref” and “that’s a fcuking foul Ref”?
 
But saying “that was a fcuking foul” is not swearing at the ref

Saying “you are a fcuking cheat” is

I thought Dan Neil did the former
That doesnt matter. The rules cover foul or insulting language regardless of who it is aimed at. If the ref also considers the actions to be distrspectful or aggressive e.g. challenging the decision aggressively by waving arms, running at him, swearing etc then that could also be considered a cautionable offence.

The challenges are two fold. One is consistency of application of the rules which people are rightly raising. Second, which is somewhat related, is there is an element of subjectivity in the interpretation of the rules. Where some people see aggressive behaviour others dont.
 
Not sure - from where I was sat quite close to where it happened he seemed to be making the point about how many incidents where Boro were playing well beyond the line and getting away with it

Saying “and that was a fcuking foul” seems to me to be making the point with emphasis - which was deserved I think

Obviously I could not hear what he said but the reaction of others seemed consistent with that

Presumably players can still appeal for free kicks? Is there a sending off difference between “that’s a foul Ref” and “that’s a fcuking foul Ref”?

I was making a bit of a general point tbf as to swearing to officials as a whole. For instance you could quite calmly explain to a ref quietly about something and say ' haway ref f***ing hell man that was no foul' Or you could run up to him screaming saying exactly the same thing. Although the words are the same the incidents are totally different and would be judged accordingly
 
I was making a bit of a general point tbf as to swearing to officials as a whole. For instance you could quite calmly explain to a ref quietly about something and say ' haway ref f***ing hell man that was no foul' Or you could run up to him screaming saying exactly the same thing. Although the words are the same the incidents are totally different and would be judged accordingly
People also react differently to the same thing at different times depending on mood. You can say something to a person one day and its fine. Another day and the same thing and they're offended. All based on emotion, stress etc. Its not black and white. Different refs will respond differently based on their temperament and mood at the time. But if you dont want to get caught out then best keep your trap shut.
 
People also react differently to the same thing at different times depending on mood. You can say something to a person one day and its fine. Another day and the same thing and they're offended. All based on emotion, stress etc. Its not black and white. Different refs will respond differently based on their temperament and mood at the time. But if you dont want to get caught out then best keep your trap shut.

I agree marra, I don't think the refs give two fucks about getting swore at. It will happen all the time. It's how it's done and the actions of the player doing it will determine the outcome
 
People also react differently to the same thing at different times depending on mood. You can say something to a person one day and its fine. Another day and the same thing and they're offended. All based on emotion, stress etc. Its not black and white. Different refs will respond differently based on their temperament and mood at the time. But if you dont want to get caught out then best keep your trap shut.
Ok all the Sunderland players keep their traps shut

We watch Boro obstruct, trip, manhandle Clark for 45 minutes meaning we cannot effective attack down their right hand side

That’s the way you expect football to be played?

Sending off Dan Neil for that was ridiculous- especially in the context of GBH on Ballard that led to….
 
Just saw the highlights when I got in. Referee seemed to love himself - shame personalities like that get involved in refereeing. Someone with the ego of a 30 goal a season striker refereeing a football match will always ruin it. Fair play to Boro they were clinical.
 
I sound Like a broken record I know but….
How many would have sent Neil off for his tackle.? You’ll never get consistentcy accross the board. If anything the ref WAS following the rules and others not. Will always happen.
Most would say, in fact nearly all would say it was a foul. The argument js whether it was a yellow or red and because there is no middle ground impossible to meet in the middle. I would give the refs either an enforced substitution or sin bin option. It wouldn't ruin the game as per today and refs could remove players who they think are going too far. Also, Neil effectively misses a game and a half, had he said the same thing on 90 mins would only miss a game. Financial penalties don't work , as the man cities of this world won't care. Still punish players for multiple enforced substitutions or sin bins but certainly in my opinion better than the fiasco of what happened today. Of course, still loads of arguments about this but that's football. All I know is had Neil been off for ten mins or we were permitted to sub him the game would have been a lot better for it. Punish the players not the game.
 
Ok all the Sunderland players keep their traps shut

We watch Boro obstruct, trip, manhandle Clark for 45 minutes meaning we cannot effective attack down their right hand side

That’s the way you expect football to be played?

Sending off Dan Neil for that was ridiculous- especially in the context of GBH on Ballard that led to….
Ok to clarify, try not to swear and run at the ref waving your arms at the ref while already on a yellow.
 
Most would say, in fact nearly all would say it was a foul. The argument js whether it was a yellow or red and because there is no middle ground impossible to meet in the middle. I would give the refs either an enforced substitution or sin bin option. It wouldn't ruin the game as per today and refs could remove players who they think are going too far. Also, Neil effectively misses a game and a half, had he said the same thing on 90 mins would only miss a game. Financial penalties don't work , as the man cities of this world won't care. Still punish players for multiple enforced substitutions or sin bins but certainly in my opinion better than the fiasco of what happened today. Of course, still loads of arguments about this but that's football. All I know is had Neil been off for ten mins or we were permitted to sub him the game would have been a lot better for it. Punish the players not the game.
For me it’s the rugby way. Ref and captain only on things like that. Swearing, arms up don’t bother me one bit and I doubt most refs but as we all know, now and again the man in the middle likes to think he’s the star of the show….
 
Ok to clarify, try not to swear and run at the ref waving your arms at the ref while already on a yellow.
Pretty sure he had forgotten about his yellow at that point ….and was just as exasperated as most of us in the crowd were about the Ref doing f’all about Boro persistently fouling and getting away with it

Still cannot see it as justifying a sending off - by a ref who seemed far too much of a Prima Donna
 
Disagree. Dissent is on the rise and needs stamping out. Players know the rules. If they mouth off they get a yellow card.
Happens all the time in games where players say thing like what Neil supposedly said today - if they clamp down on this in every game there will be no one left on the pitch ! You can understand it if he swore “at the ref” but come on - before long the game is going to end up so sanitised and controlled by computerised crap it won’t be worth watching
 
I would be annoyed if it was us because its a stupid booking and you see something of the like in every game.
The Sky commentator said all the players were told at the begining of the season that anyone approaching the referee from a distance shouting,swearing or gesticulating would be booked.
 
I would be annoyed if it was us because its a stupid booking and you see something of the like in every game.
The Sky commentator said all the players were told at the begining of the season that anyone approaching the referee from a distance shouting,swearing or gesticulating would be booked.
Which is fair had all refs been consistent doing it but thats far from the case, there were plenty other times today players could and should have been booked and weren't, Greenwood for e.g. lucky to stay on the pitch (rules of the game etc) - had he actually been sent off for 2 daft things it would have been ridiculous, but it seems this is where football is heading
 
Ok to clarify, try not to swear and run at the ref waving your arms at the ref while already on a yellow.
He didn’t run at the ref which was why he was sent off.

He was sent off for dissent and running towards the ref.

He was walking at him complaining about a shite decision.

I will not accept that it’s grounds for a red card unless going forward the same ref keeps up the same standard.

He 100% won’t send anyone else off for that in his next 10 games.
Was pathetic.
 
Obviously Dan was frustrated that Boro fouls were going unpunished, the incident that lead to the sending off wasn’t the first.
I think if the referee reviews the tape of the game he would be disappointed although he would never admit that
 
That legbreaker could've been a red, woz lucky to be on the pitch in first place then just stupid moaning at ref !


Think that was playing on the Refs mind that he should have been sent off for the lunging out of control studs up tackle. If it had been against us we would have been baying for a red.

Probably looking for the first opportunity to give him a second yellow.
 

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