Committed to Academy 1 status and a big turn around - Rodwell


Status
Not open for further replies.
This an absolute key point. However, a new Academy Director is a good first step.
Only if he stands up to the owners & is willing to fight for what he or his staff believes in.
Genuinely believe now, Reid was only in place because he would do and say as he was told. And now he’s been made the scapegoat.
Don’t believe he did himself any favours mind.
But he was never brought in to do anything other than tick the box.
 
Show me these rules please?


Also how did Bellingham not leave Birmingham for pennies at any point to go to Man Utd? I mean, he’s 16 so nothing Birmingham could/can do according to Kildare

Of course it’s difficult to hold onto talent when the big clubs come circling, but this bullshit that the club were absolutely defenceless has to stop.

We hawked out players. You know what happened with your son. We know the club didn’t fight to keep hold of our best talent. The owners attitidue has been a disgrace. Most Sunderland fans are unhappy with what’s gone on, yet Kildare still posts 3000 times a day on the academy.

He’s not a Sunderland fan, knew nothing about the club, history or recent players when he first pitched up on here.

He’s either an elaborate wum, or he has a connection to the club/academy somehow. His obsession is mental
 
Last edited:
It's a positive step if he was not fit for purpose, I don't really know one way or the other and suspect that the job in the current conditions will be very difficult for anyone.
True but it’s made more difficult by living at the other end of the country. I doubt the current owners would’ve allowed a stranger to apply for the job, get it and do it from 300+ miles away. It’s a perfect example of their small time “jobs for the boys” short term mentality.
 
Also how did Bellingham not leave Birmingham for pennies at any point to go to Man Utd? I mean, he’s 16 so nothing Birmingham could/can do according to Kildare

Of course it’s difficult to hold onto talent when the big clubs come circling, but this bullshit that the club were absolutely defenceless has to stop.

We hawked out players. You know what happened with your son. We know the club didn’t fight to keep hold of our best talent. The owners attitidue has been a disgrace. Most Sunderland fans are unhappy with what’s gone on, yet Kildare still posts 3000 times a day on the academy.

He’s not a Sunderland fan, knew nothing about the club, history or recent players when he first pitched up on here.

He’s either an elaborate wum, or he has a connection to the club/academy somehow. His obsession is mental
I think it’s just an argument he’s after.
He started the subject up again, no one had mentioned players leaving/sold, not what the thread was about...
Just after reactions I guess.
 
Only if he stands up to the owners & is willing to fight for what he or his staff believes in.
Genuinely believe now, Reid was only in place because he would do and say as he was told. And now he’s been made the scapegoat.
Don’t believe he did himself any favours mind.
But he was never brought in to do anything other than tick the box.
Probably correct although looking at Reid's background he had little to suggest he should be running such an Academy. For whatever reason Rodwell is suggesting a change in approach. I totally understand that the cynicism that people have about such words but taken just on their own merit you have to say that Rodwell is saying exactly what should be done to improve the situation.

Additionally, I could argue that where Donald and co. have failed is that the size and demands of running SAFC is way beyond their experience and what they were expecting. Their appointments may well have not been 'yes men' but people who lack the basic competencies and experience - Reid and Hill are out of their depth rather than just towing the line. Also, Rodwell has been brought in to make the decisions and set the strategy and address failings. I get that Rodwell has a poor track record but his words alone make sense - lets see who he brings in. For me, this is a positive step but time will tell.
 
Also how did Bellingham not leave Birmingham for pennies at any point to go to Man Utd? I mean, he’s 16 so nothing Birmingham could/can do according to Kildare

Of course it’s difficult to hold onto talent when the big clubs come circling, but this bullshit that the club were absolutely defenceless has to stop.

We hawked out players. You know what happened with your son. We know the club didn’t fight to keep hold of our best talent. The owners attitidue has been a disgrace. Most Sunderland fans are unhappy with what’s gone on, yet Kildare still posts 3000 times a day on the academy.

He’s not a Sunderland fan, knew nothing about the club, history or recent players when he first pitched up on here.

He’s either an elaborate wum, or he has a connection to the club/academy somehow. His obsession is mental
.....as his choice of trouser colour.
Balanced? Able to admit I'm wrong when I am? Fair enough
😄
 
Last edited:
True but it’s made more difficult by living at the other end of the country. I doubt the current owners would’ve allowed a stranger to apply for the job, get it and do it from 300+ miles away. It’s a perfect example of their small time “jobs for the boys” short term mentality.
That's seems fair enough mind, not sure how he did the job from the other end of the country.
 
Retaining category 1 status is obviously good news but this whole situation shows a lack of a long term on the pitch strategy and no joined up thinking at all.

Selling Mumba because he has 1 year left and doesn't want to sign a new contract is the right thing to do in isolation. But you only have to take a half step back to understand why an 18 year old England youth International who made his debut at this club 2 years ago, might not want to sign a new contract given he was loaned out to South Shields last season, the youth sides started to play him out of his position, the club has 4/5 senior pros playing in his actual position and we have a manager who keeps the same team 9 times out of 10.

We need a coordinated strategy, that sees players from the academy move into the first team. That means a change in recruitment policy and a manager who is pulling in the same direction.
Agree. Regardless of their fine words the academy and U18/U23 teams have just been run down over the last two years
Promising young lads have left and the development of the older lads has been atrocious.
Two years ago we had a thriving set up at all levels but I cant think of one player who have developed/improved
Most have gone backwards massively. You can expect that with one or two in a squad but not everyone
Something is sadly wrong with the place.

In that respect good news Reid leaving, however I have no faith in the current regime to do anything but spout fine words and banal platitudes
Rodwell is just a mouth piece and is saying the same as the owners did two years ago.
What we need now is action and a progressive long term plan.
I won't hold my breath.
 
Also how did Bellingham not leave Birmingham for pennies at any point to go to Man Utd? I mean, he’s 16 so nothing Birmingham could/can do according to Kildare

Of course it’s difficult to hold onto talent when the big clubs come circling, but this bullshit that the club were absolutely defenceless has to stop.

We hawked out players. You know what happened with your son. We know the club didn’t fight to keep hold of our best talent. The owners attitidue has been a disgrace. Most Sunderland fans are unhappy with what’s gone on, yet Kildare still posts 3000 times a day on the academy.

He’s not a Sunderland fan, knew nothing about the club, history or recent players when he first pitched up on here.

He’s either an elaborate wum, or he has a connection to the club/academy somehow. His obsession is mental

Belllingham was an academy scholar who had played first team football. That massively ramps up what can be done. For younger players, once an approach is allowed all you have is persuasion.
 
Agree. Regardless of their fine words the academy and U18/U23 teams have just been run down over the last two years
Promising young lads have left and the development of the older lads has been atrocious.
Two years ago we had a thriving set up at all levels but I cant think of one player who have developed/improved
Most have gone backwards massively. You can expect that with one or two in a squad but not everyone
Something is sadly wrong with the place.

In that respect good news Reid leaving, however I have no faith in the current regime to do anything but spout fine words and banal platitudes
Rodwell is just a mouth piece and is saying the same as the owners did two years ago.
What we need now is action and a progressive long term plan.
I won't hold my breath.

It's possible (and likely) that Rodwell is just a mouth piece, though he has been given management responsibility by the owners and I doubt he wants to be a fall guy. It's also possible (but less likely) that this is action being taken following recommendations from the non executive directors that were appointed last year and actually see the club from the fans perspective.
 
No not at all.
Good man.
They’ll tell the truth sometimes. It may only be the law of averages that causes it though. They may even do it deliberately to muddy the waters and suck in those who are desperate to be sucked in.
It's possible (and likely) that Rodwell is just a mouth piece, though he has been given management responsibility by the owners and I doubt he wants to be a fall guy. It's also possible (but less likely) that this is action being taken following recommendations from the non executive directors that were appointed last year and actually see the club from the fans perspective.
I hope you’re reet marra. If so it’d be the first backstage positive development since this regime washed up here.
 
Last edited:
Also how did Bellingham not leave Birmingham for pennies at any point to go to Man Utd? I mean, he’s 16 so nothing Birmingham could/can do according to Kildare

Of course it’s difficult to hold onto talent when the big clubs come circling, but this bullshit that the club were absolutely defenceless has to stop.

We hawked out players. You know what happened with your son. We know the club didn’t fight to keep hold of our best talent. The owners attitidue has been a disgrace. Most Sunderland fans are unhappy with what’s gone on, yet Kildare still posts 3000 times a day on the academy.

He’s not a Sunderland fan, knew nothing about the club, history or recent players when he first pitched up on here.

He’s either an elaborate wum, or he has a connection to the club/academy somehow. His obsession is mental

He'd signed a contract at the age of 16 with them - if they'd come in prior to that, which to be honest, you'd think he would of been on all the top teams radars much earlier as he has captained a lot of the England youth teams; there isn't much Birmingham could have done other than to offer him a contract and receive compensation or negotiate a deal with the "bidding club".

As bigger teams come touting for younger and younger talent there needs to be new rules brought in to prevent players being developed from a young age by a club and then the bigger clubs reaping the rewards from it by getting them to them before they sign professional forms. I'm guessing there is something in employment law which prevents them from signing anything prior to aged 16.

The only reason the club will try to keep category 1 is that if a player does choose to leave and it goes to compensation, Category 1 clubs get a higher amount than Category 2. Saying that, if they don't move domestically, they can pretty much move for nothing abroad. It's one of the reasons clubs have affiliated clubs in other countries to work around this.
 
Not really sure what to make of this? They need to do something to stop the drain of talent but I can’t see what now.
Released 18 players and the best of the 16 -18 year olds all gone or going. We are not going to get any better at that Level for a while

Exactly. Their short-termist approach of wanting a quick buck will have us hamstrung for a good few years
 
What he has said does address the concerns we have raised. Whether he does or can do anything to reverse the trend remains to be seen. However, he has got rid of Reid and seemingly identified one of the problems with the set up. He will be appointing someone with the brief to retain more talent and try to create a vision of how that talent is recruited and moves through the age groups. Let's hope he makes a good appointment. Taking away whether you choose to believe his words this is the first positive step for a long, long time and is good to hear. I totally understand the constant cynicism but he Rodwell has done something beyond words - got rid of an underperforming Donald appointment in Reid and that should be acknowledged.

You should say something about him getting shot of an under performing mate of Donald's - that is a positive and lets hope a sign of things to come.

I absolutely agree with this. Getting rid of Reid was a concern at first, because we didn't know if it meant that they were simply closing/ mothballing the academy. Now, I know they say one thing and do the other with alarming regularity, but I'd be amazed if he came out with this and u-turned before the end of the season, it would be the absolute last straw for almost every supporter.

So, assuming they aren't closing the academy and are replacing Reid, it has to be seen as a rare good move. We're always saying that Reid is shit, a mate of the owners, and that his performance needs to be evaluated, with a replacement brought in if required. If Rodwell has had a say in him leaving then it's a positive mark against him in my book because it shows that he's identified a (clearly) underperforming area and has taken an immediate action to try and improve it. We can't see that as anything other than a positive imo.

The next big test comes in who they bring in and, more crucially, what impact they have. If it's another jobs for the boys appointment then that undoes the good they've done by getting rid of Reid. If the next person underperforms then it suggests that either they still can't hire the right person (a major concern) or maybe the strategy of the owners prevents anyone from succeeding in the role (also a major concern). For now though I'll see this as a good move and hope the next appointment is a result of a good recruitment process. If it is, and since Donald has never done that yet, I'll give Rodwell a fair bit of credit for it. This isn't saying he's mint or we should trust him implicitly, but I don't want to just go criticising everything that everyone does, when they get a rare decision right they deserve a modicum of praise for it.
 
Anyone half decent at academy has been sold or they’re in the process of going, the results are absolutely disgusting, the academy director who’s just left was a buffoon. Obvious where all of this is leading despite what that puppet Rodwell says.
 
Belllingham was an academy scholar who had played first team football. That massively ramps up what can be done. For younger players, once an approach is allowed all you have is persuasion.

So if someone is 16 but has played first team football, the rules/laws are different to a 16 year old who hasn’t?
 
He'd signed a contract at the age of 16 with them - if they'd come in prior to that, which to be honest, you'd think he would of been on all the top teams radars much earlier as he has captained a lot of the England youth teams; there isn't much Birmingham could have done other than to offer him a contract and receive compensation or negotiate a deal with the "bidding club".

As bigger teams come touting for younger and younger talent there needs to be new rules brought in to prevent players being developed from a young age by a club and then the bigger clubs reaping the rewards from it by getting them to them before they sign professional forms. I'm guessing there is something in employment law which prevents them from signing anything prior to aged 16.

The only reason the club will try to keep category 1 is that if a player does choose to leave and it goes to compensation, Category 1 clubs get a higher amount than Category 2. Saying that, if they don't move domestically, they can pretty much move for nothing abroad. It's one of the reasons clubs have affiliated clubs in other countries to work around this.
The FL clubs chose to accept the PL offer of £250k a year to bend ower wether they produced any good kids or not. SAFC were part of the PL that offered the deal. I’m not sure how long the deal lasts. I’d be interested to know if Brentford still get their cut since they abandoned their academy status. I bet THATS been discussed at safc boardroom level.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Back
Top