At what point does "level of expectancy" become arrogance?

[The Great Soprendo]

Even putting all the history and status in the game to one side, with the resources and facilities available to SAFC there is no way we should be in this division. That's not arrogance, it's just obvious, and purely down to how badly we've been run for years. I'd also never be arrogant enough to think we have a right to beat a team that we're in the same division as, even if our players are arguably superior in ability. It has to be earned, every time.

 

[samaistonsrightfoot]

Last time we played Rochdale they released a celebratory mug to mark the occasion. We are in big trouble this season if we can't beat them.

 

[Junior Birdman]

I know history and fans don't win you football matches, but a simple look at the attendances for league one matches should tell you we don't belong in this league.

 

[Far Tibetan Mountain]

Seems to be a topic occupying everyone from the owners, the manager, players and some fans at our club so I wondered if we could define what it is.

For me personally we should be comfortably beating tonight's opponents. We're bigger in all respects....history, stadium and academy, fan base and income.

IF, however we were in the Championship and playing one of a dozen clubs like West Brom, Stoke, Leeds, Boro, Fulham etc then I have no expectancy that we should beat any of these fine clubs. Surely that's all it is....i think I know our level and L1 is beneath that. Its not arrogant to think that surely.

when you go from supporting the lads and bugging them up to booing their touches and making them hate to go into work, probably.

 

[viccarlton]

Seems to be a topic occupying everyone from the owners, the manager, players and some fans at our club so I wondered if we could define what it is.

For me personally we should be comfortably beating tonight's opponents. We're bigger in all respects....history, stadium and academy, fan base and income.

IF, however we were in the Championship and playing one of a dozen clubs like West Brom, Stoke, Leeds, Boro, Fulham etc then I have no expectancy that we should beat any of these fine clubs. Surely that's all it is....i think I know our level and L1 is beneath that. Its not arrogant to think that surely.

We should expect to beat every team in this league, the fact that we can't is a bit of a reality check, we're no better than anyone else.

 

[Angmering]

There’s a difference between expecting to win a game and believing we have a right to win it.

I’d expect us to win our next two games based upon our team’s ability.

We have to believe we can win it Jack, but that starts at the kick off an equal with Rochdale. Ability, determination and game management with dare I say a bit of luck, will all need to be determining factors for us to win(and of course the players in the right frame of mind and up for it). I’ve taken Willis to score the first or last goals at 33s. You know what they say then two come along

 

[chuckyroll]

We have no devine right. However our expectancy isn't arrogant. We are bigger and better than these clubs and more importantly definitely in my opinion have better players than the results we have had since November last year. We have an inexperienced man in charge that seems to struggle with the concept of playing to players strengths. Whether he learns from it is open to debate. Last season this squad should have won the league.

 

[The Muffin Man]

Seems to be a topic occupying everyone from the owners, the manager, players and some fans at our club so I wondered if we could define what it is.

For me personally we should be comfortably beating tonight's opponents. We're bigger in all respects....history, stadium and academy, fan base and income.

IF, however we were in the Championship and playing one of a dozen clubs like West Brom, Stoke, Leeds, Boro, Fulham etc then I have no expectancy that we should beat any of these fine clubs. Surely that's all it is....i think I know our level and L1 is beneath that. Its not arrogant to think that surely.

Oh we passed the level of arrogance a long long time ago, many people on here have become like mags and think we have a god given right to win the league simply because we are Sunderland. Ask most fans in the league and they see us as being arrogant.

 

[Hongkongphooey]

Oh we passed the level of arrogance a long long time ago, many people on here have become like mags and think we have a god given right to win the league simply because we are Sunderland. Ask most fans in the league and they see us as being arrogant.

And you love sticking the boot in about our fans, forgetting the amount of shite we’ve had to put up with over the years. Give it a rest ffs.

 

[The Muffin Man]

We have no devine right. However our expectancy isn't arrogant. We are bigger and better than these clubs and more importantly definitely in my opinion have better players than the results we have had since November last year. We have an inexperienced man in charge that seems to struggle with the concept of playing to players strengths. Whether he learns from it is open to debate. Last season this squad should have won the league.

While we maybe historically bigger the arrogance is in the idea we are better......There is literally nothing in our clubs history in the past 10 years suggests we are better than most league 1 clubs in fact but for Short paying off the debt which he had no obligation to do we would literally be Bolton or Bury now......We are not better at all, the club is finally being turned round by owners who are running it properly but for the last 8 years or so the club has been a complete shambles from top to bottom and an example to all other clubs of how not to operate, we have literally been a basket case.

 

[West_Winger]

Seems to be a topic occupying everyone from the owners, the manager, players and some fans at our club so I wondered if we could define what it is.

For me personally we should be comfortably beating tonight's opponents. We're bigger in all respects....history, stadium and academy, fan base and income.

IF, however we were in the Championship and playing one of a dozen clubs like West Brom, Stoke, Leeds, Boro, Fulham etc then I have no expectancy that we should beat any of these fine clubs. Surely that's all it is....i think I know our level and L1 is beneath that. Its not arrogant to think that surely.

We’ve spent double what the rest of the league has on transfers. Can you imagine if Man City had spent the equivalent in the Premier League and managed a 5th place finish.

And you love sticking the boot in about our fans, forgetting the amount of shite we’ve had to put up with over the years. Give it a rest ffs.

He’s saying that the fans on here are mag-like yet on the first day of the season he said that “if we don’t go up automatically with this squad then we should jack it all in.”

 

[The Muffin Man]

And you love sticking the boot in about our fans, forgetting the amount of shite we’ve had to put up with over the years. Give it a rest ffs.

If you dont want the truth then dont ask questions like "at what point does expectancy become arrogance"......I will stop sticking the boot into an element of our fans when they stop being part of the problem. And Im not sure the original question stipulated that you could only answer if you thought that actually we are not in the slightest bit arrogant and we are right to expect to storm the league......We are becoming magesque in our sense of entitlement and is nauseating.

 

[Angmering]

We have no devine right. However our expectancy isn't arrogant. We are bigger and better than these clubs and more importantly definitely in my opinion have better players than the results we have had since November last year. We have an inexperienced man in charge that seems to struggle with the concept of playing to players strengths. Whether he learns from it is open to debate. Last season this squad should have won the league.

No we haven’t Chuck, like the expectancy we should have won the league(we did miss out on both counts by the margin of a rolly paper) we didn’t. You don’t assume nothing, because we all know what assumption creates. Let’s earn it.

 

[The Muffin Man]

We’ve spent double what the rest of the league has on transfers. Can you imagine if Man City had spent the equivalent in the Premier League and managed a 5th place finish.


He’s saying that the fans on here are mag-like yet on the first day of the season he said that “if we don’t go up automatically with this squad then we should jack it all in.”

I think this squad should go up but I also get football and know that there are teams like Luton last year and apparently like Lincoln have started off this year that just click and take the top spots......The arrogance is in believing that because we are Sunderland and have 30,000 fans each week we somehow just need to turn up to win the league and anything less than that is embarrassing......The turn of phrase I used there was used to show that I thought we had an extremely strong squad and we have but I if we dont go up I wont be slagging the other teams off, calling them piss pot clubs, pub teams and the league shite......That is where the arrogance comes from and its disgusting tbh.

 

[Rick O Shea]

We 'earned' our right to be in League 1 - so we have to earn our right to get out of it again. And we'll have to get used to it not being very pretty for a while as we have to accept that we now have a squad of predominantly players for the level we find ourselves at.

 

[chuckyroll]

No we haven’t Chuck, like the expectancy we should have won the league(we did miss out on both counts by the margin of a rolly paper) we didn’t. You don’t assume nothing, because we all know what assumption creates. Let’s earn it.

Whether we have the manager to help us earn is open to debate.

 

[Angmering]

Whether we have the manager to help us earn is open to debate.

We do, the players and the fans too, we have just got to earn it collectively.

 

[Yankee Mackem]

When it series logic. For instance, at this level, if a team outspends the majority of the league by a significant amount you would expect your team to finish in the top three or four.

 

[Jack Ford]

We 'earned' our right to be in League 1 - so we have to earn our right to get out of it again. And we'll have to get used to it not being very pretty for a while as we have to accept that we now have a squad of predominantly players for the level we find ourselves at.

Agree. Just because we may be a big club is doesn't necessarily mean we are any better (on the pitch) than the so called smaller clubs. We must earn our right on the pitch and just having the biggest attendances in the division does not mean we will succeed.

There's nothing wrong with expectation though and I guess fans of other clubs may perceive this expectation as arrogance

 

[daveyt]

We are where we deserve to be. All the peripheral stuff adds up to sweet FA if the results on the pitch don’t come.

What I don’t get is the assumption that all our ingrained woes can somehow miraculously disappear in the space of a year or so.

We can’t expect to keep pressing the reset button year after year and somehow retain any semblance of the DNA of a successful organisation.

Patience is what our fans lack.