Anti mask demonstrations - Trafalgar Square



You know what it means already clearly and are trying to act the smart arse.

An answer for everything

No. I don't. Nobody dies. It means the number reported is the number of people who tested positive in the 28 days before they died. It tells us far far less than we need to know. What it definitely doesn't tell us is how many people were killed by the virus. Don't trot that figure out without understanding how completely misguided and uninformative it is. Leave that to the media who want suckered to click on the headline.
 
No. I don't. Nobody dies. It means the number reported is the number of people who tested positive in the 28 days before they died. It tells us far far less than we need to know. What it definitely doesn't tell us is how many people were killed by the virus. Don't trot that figure out without understanding how completely misguided and uninformative it is. Leave that to the media who want suckered to click on the headline.

Something like 50,000 death certificates mention COVID. That means that in the opinion of the doctor certifying the death, COVID played a part in causing that persons death, either in the direct sequence resulting in death, or as a contributory factor to the patient's condition at the time of death.
 
Something like 50,000 death certificates mention COVID. That means that in the opinion of the doctor certifying the death, COVID played a part in causing that persons death, either in the direct sequence resulting in death, or as a contributory factor to the patient's condition at the time of death.


According to PHE the deaths reported as covid include those that tested positive within 28 days of death. I'm happy to stand corrected if you can show me the alternative.
 

Unless I'm reading that spreadsheet wrong, the total of the weekly deaths involving COVID 19 with COVID 19 on the death certificate, is 51,818

That is distinct from those who test positive and die within X days, because some of those death certificates will involve doctors listing 'suspected COVID-19' as the cause
 
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No. I don't. Nobody dies. It means the number reported is the number of people who tested positive in the 28 days before they died. It tells us far far less than we need to know. What it definitely doesn't tell us is how many people were killed by the virus. Don't trot that figure out without understanding how completely misguided and uninformative it is. Leave that to the media who want suckered to click on the headline.
Oh yeah the media are lying to us.

That old f***ing chestnut.
 
Oh yeah the media are lying to us.

That old f***ing chestnut.

No they're not. They are reporting on the statistics. It's up to the public to make an effort to understand what it means. Like I say, the figures include people who tested positive for covid. It does not just include those who died directly from covid. You didn't know that. Now you do.
 
No they're not. They are reporting on the statistics. It's up to the public to make an effort to understand what it means. Like I say, the figures include people who tested positive for covid. It does not just include those who died directly from covid. You didn't know that. Now you do.
I know 50,000 people are dead mate, if that makes you feel better so be it. You need to follow the rules.
 
I know 50,000 people are dead mate, if that makes you feel better so be it. You need to follow the rules.

Why would it make me feel better? I'm following the rules. You keep believing that covid killed 50000 people 👍
 
So what number is it then Einstein? 40,000? 30,000?! That’s still f***ing huge

Its the number of people who tested positive for covid when they died. I have no idea how many people were killed by Covid. You don't need to be Einstein. You just need to be able to read.
 
No. Its not the number of people killed by covid.

Am I misreading the spreadsheet presented? The sum total was 51,818 deaths where COVID-19 is on the death certificate. If we're not willing to accept medical opinion as the gold standard here, taking into account that many deaths will have happened without the person being in any condition to be tested, or without the ability to be tested, what can we accept as the standard for 'COVID caused this death'?
 
Am I misreading the spreadsheet presented? The sum total was 51,818 deaths where COVID-19 is on the death certificate. If we're not willing to accept medical opinion as the gold standard here, taking into account that many deaths will have happened without the person being in any condition to be tested, or without the ability to be tested, what can we accept as the standard for 'COVID caused this death'?

Its still a long way from saying they were killed by Covid. If covid is found to be present in the patient prior to death then is it not fair to assume that it will be included on the death certificate regardless of how minimal it was in its contribution to the death.
 
Anyone know the average age of deaths for Covid im the UK? The only thing I can find is a full bar graph breaking deaths down in 10 year increments. The vast majority seem to be above 75 year old, which makes me wonder how it compares with current life expectancy.
 
Its still a long way from saying they were killed by Covid. If covid is found to be present in the patient prior to death then is it not fair to assume that it will be included on the death certificate regardless of how minimal it was in its contribution to the death.

The guidance for completing death certificates is clear:

1a - in this field you enter the disease or condition directly leading to death
1b - in this field you enter the disease or condition, if any, which lead to 1a
1c - in this field, you enter the disease or condition, if any, which lead to 1b

2 - in this field you enter other 'significant' conditions contributing to the death, but not ones that caused the death

A typical COVID death certificate may look like:

1a - viral pneumonitis
1b - COVID-19
1c -

2 - diabetes

A death certificate does not tell you to what extent a condition contributed to someone's death - no official documentation does, for the vast majority of deaths anyways.

If you can't accept this methodology for this cause of death, then you can't really accept it for any other cause of death you may wish to compare COVID to, because all cause of death statistics will rely on the content of the death certificate.
 
Anyone know the average age of deaths for Covid im the UK? The only thing I can find is a full bar graph breaking deaths down in 10 year increments. The vast majority seem to be above 75 year old, which makes me wonder how it compares with current life expectancy.

It will be close to life expectancy, but you must remember - life expectancy is more or less the average age of death, and not the average age someone can expect to live to, if they reach 70, e.g. the life expectancy for someone who reaches 70 is about mid 80s, but the life expectancy in the UK is less than that, because life expectancy is brought down, by people who die young.
 
That would equate to 11 million people having had the virus or 17% of the population. Around 1 in 6.
Not if early on a certain demographic were sitting ducks. Say, old people, who were near deaths door, all in the same building.
There is not a chance your figure is anywhere near accurate.
 

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