24th March 1985...blunders by Len Ashurst, Clive Walker and Davie

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Had a ticket but never went , so reckon the crowd was 99,999 not 100,000 as stated. Wasn't this the last time Wembley had 100,000 crowd ?. It was talked about later as being the friendly final, with both sets of supporters getting along. It is often said it was the last great English cup final , before the game changed ( for the worse IMO ) all seater stadiums , excessive tv exposure, rule changes , cups downgraded etc
 
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Re 85, didn't think we played that badly, Norwich also didn't really play well at all but got the big break in the game - still think their goal was offside.

Yeah me too.... I always felt we were in the game...unlike the Swindon game. Had Walkers pen gone in we would have gone on to win imo....but it was a much better dsy out than the Swindon game. Fans were tremoundous at the Milk Cup final
 
Yeah me too.... I always felt we were in the game...unlike the Swindon game. Had Walkers pen gone in we would have gone on to win imo....but it was a much better dsy out than the Swindon game. Fans were tremoundous at the Milk Cup final
Didn't Chelsea turn up at the Punch n Judy ?
 
Like one or two others, undoubtedly one of my all-time biggest disappointments following SAFC. It didn't occur to me that we could actually lose in 85 - apart from anything else we'd beaten Norwich 3-1 at their place the previous week.

As for Westy, apparently SAFC had received a bid of £100k+ from Watford and were very keen to do the deal. Not sure of the exact timeline of events but if that was before the final then that may have played a part in the decision to drop him to piss him off enough to encourage him to move...

And yes allegedly Cowie pissed the players off re tickets and bonuses for the final - which sounds about right.

One of the great 'What If' moments in the history of SAFC revolved around that final: If Shaun Elliott hadn't have been booked in the semi at Chelsea he would have played in the final instead of Corner. Even if the players had still frozen at Wembley we might have got away with a draw. The replay would have been at Hillsborough on Wednesday 3rd April 1985 and I reckon we would have blown them away (on and off the pitch).

The feel good factor of winning the cup would have meant we wouldn't have gone down... Ashurst would have stayed (to be fair to him, our league record that season was pretty good before the cup run became the players' primary/only focus after the win at Tottenham)... Mackem Enemy and his crocks wouldn't have arrived etc etc... The entire second half on the 80s might have been completely different if Shaun Elliott hadn't have been booked at Chelsea...
 
Like one or two others, undoubtedly one of my all-time biggest disappointments following SAFC. It didn't occur to me that we could actually lose in 85 - apart from anything else we'd beaten Norwich 3-1 at their place the previous week.

As for Westy, apparently SAFC had received a bid of £100k+ from Watford and were very keen to do the deal. Not sure of the exact timeline of events but if that was before the final then that may have played a part in the decision to drop him to piss him off enough to encourage him to move...

And yes allegedly Cowie pissed the players off re tickets and bonuses for the final - which sounds about right.

One of the great 'What If' moments in the history of SAFC revolved around that final: If Shaun Elliott hadn't have been booked in the semi at Chelsea he would have played in the final instead of Corner. Even if the players had still frozen at Wembley we might have got away with a draw. The replay would have been at Hillsborough on Wednesday 3rd April 1985 and I reckon we would have blown them away (on and off the pitch).

The feel good factor of winning the cup would have meant we wouldn't have gone down... Ashurst would have stayed (to be fair to him, our league record that season was pretty good before the cup run became the players' primary/only focus after the win at Tottenham)... Mackem Enemy and his crocks wouldn't have arrived etc etc... The entire second half on the 80s might have been completely different if Shaun Elliott hadn't have been booked at Chelsea...
Never really thought about it that deeply but you are spot on imho.
 
Didn't Chelsea turn up at the Punch n Judy ?

I dont know about that mate

Like one or two others, undoubtedly one of my all-time biggest disappointments following SAFC. It didn't occur to me that we could actually lose in 85 - apart from anything else we'd beaten Norwich 3-1 at their place the previous week.

As for Westy, apparently SAFC had received a bid of £100k+ from Watford and were very keen to do the deal. Not sure of the exact timeline of events but if that was before the final then that may have played a part in the decision to drop him to piss him off enough to encourage him to move...

And yes allegedly Cowie pissed the players off re tickets and bonuses for the final - which sounds about right.

One of the great 'What If' moments in the history of SAFC revolved around that final: If Shaun Elliott hadn't have been booked in the semi at Chelsea he would have played in the final instead of Corner. Even if the players had still frozen at Wembley we might have got away with a draw. The replay would have been at Hillsborough on Wednesday 3rd April 1985 and I reckon we would have blown them away (on and off the pitch).

The feel good factor of winning the cup would have meant we wouldn't have gone down... Ashurst would have stayed (to be fair to him, our league record that season was pretty good before the cup run became the players' primary/only focus after the win at Tottenham)... Mackem Enemy and his crocks wouldn't have arrived etc etc... The entire second half on the 80s might have been completely different if Shaun Elliott hadn't have been booked at Chelsea...

It didnt help us that we beat Norwich the week before ( apart from our league position ) . I always thought that we might have thought it would be easy following that win. Iirc Steve Bruce didnt play in the league game
 
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I read Ashurst's book on holiday in February. He's a bit of a cold fish and hard to relate to. His take on the Cup Final is also a bit odd.

He mentions about the players being a bit pissed off with the lack of tickets and bonuses. He also mentions that in his opinion he dropped West prior to the final and that because he didn't get the right reaction from him in training he left him out of the final too.

IMO he's full of shit. I was down Norwich the week before the final and I assumed that he was resting Westy. Wallace played and scored but as per usual he was f***ing rubbish.

On the balance of play Norwich deserved a draw in the league game. We played quite well, got 2 - 1 up but then we were heavily under the cosh. We then broke away to score a goal completely against the run of play in the last minute to give us a flattering 3-1 victory.

West should have 100% played in the final. OK his attitude in training might not have been great but he was dropped for a complete plank in Wallace who was a terrible signing.

Years later Ashurst offered West his loser medal and was told to shove it up his arse. He is in complete denial in his book, very poor IMO.
 
In the run up to the 1985 Milk Cup Final SAFC had stayed at the Spider's Web Motel motel in Watford and had decided to make it their 'lucky' base for the final. A minibus full of us decided that it might be a good idea to stay there as well in the hope of seeing some of the players. It turned out to be a good decision. About mid-evening most of the squad showed up in the bar and spread themselves around. No one noticed that Colin West was not amongst them. In conversations with the team, not one Sunderland player gave away the fact that Len Ashurst had decided not to include West in the starting line-up despite the fact that it was his goals in no small part that had propelled us to the final. The general mood of the players we felt was somewhat subdued on the night before a Wembley appearance and this, it turned out was to be reflected in the team performance against Norwich. A couple of us sat at the bar with Stan Cummins for about an hour or so - he was drinking OJ of course. He showed himself to be a class act off the pitch as well as on it. Top bloke. 20 - 20 hindsight is an easy gift but I still can't help feeling that it was Westies treatment that influenced the outcome of the match more than any other single event including Corner's rubbish attempt at shepherding the ball out of play for a goal kick. Ho hum. Further to an earlier post I think that the FA Cup Final a few weeks later was probably the last 100.000 attendance.
 
.... Corner see Norwich City beat us one nil at Wembley in the L. C. final at Wembley.

Ashurst drops semi final hero Colin West in preference to Ian Wallace who is anonymous in the game, and Davie C is robbed on the byeline leading to a shot that is heading for the keepers arms until it deflects off Chisholm and rolls in. Typical safc luck.:rolleyes:

Walker, who has been so reliable from the spot all season misses the big one after Venison had been fouled early in 2nd half. Nightmare:confused:

Hodgson almost scores in the first minute but overall, Safc didn't do a great deal to give the fans much to shout about.
Always though it was handball and Midgley indicated.
 

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