“If the performance was poor from minute one, I’d have accepted that as a potential criticism, but we were at it on Saturday."

Morse said:
Well, it wasn’t long before the pro Ross side descended into ad hominem...

I can handle opinions. What I dislike is people selectively filtering out comments or simply ignoring anything that they have no argument against, or setting arbitrary points of time during which to judge Ross.

It’s easy to argue against pro Ross posters, you simply can’t defend a record spend in L1, more than the entire league combined. Then there’s ‘we’re a league 1 team’, while putting no blame at Ross’s door for this.

When you address these points in a cogent manner, maybe I’ll take you seriously. ;)
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Iam tired of putting everything in context, feels like I’ve done a dozen times. Sorry you missed it. You mustn’t be on here as much as perceived
 


Chewit said:
Iam tired of putting everything in context, feels like I’ve done a dozen times. Sorry you missed it. You mustn’t be on here as much as perceived
Click to expand...

Ouch! :lol:

Right, obviously I’ve missed something.

We could’ve gone out of existence. Luckily, new owners came in, hired Ross and made funds available that the other L1 clubs could only dream of. Well done the owners.

Ross has come in, stated anything less than promotion is failure, and been given an enormous budget (bigger than all the other clubs combined) to build his squad.
He became known as the draw specialist, and seemed content to grind out points with unimaginative, boring, defensive football. We never really looked like finishing top, and neither did we really look a class above anyone we played. Teams who spent a tiny fraction of what we did in the transfer market regularly managed to match us, and a few beat us.
We finish 5th. 5th in L1. The worst finish in our entire history.

The owners keep Ross, maybe more because they didn’t want to pay him off than trusting him, but that’s conjecture.
He fails to address the issues we have, and we start the season at first as we left off.
We’ve had a few wins, including one very pleasing one at Portsmouth and a great cup win v Burnley. We aren’t looking convincing, but we pulled off some good results so far.

Given our spend, we really aren’t punching our weight, and Ross hasn’t managed to make his expensive squad shine like it should.

Anything there you disagree with?
 
LineTrash said:
No it’s not a legitimate view point!! We outspent this entire league combined! How is that a legitimate League 1 side??? We are a failure of a League 1 side if we have to spend 10x other clubs just to finish 5th. Do you not see the incompetence at SAFC with how we run as a club??
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No , sorry mate I don't see it , budget amounts means absolutely nothing imo, we were a train wreck last season was all about stability , we almost exceeded that . This season we hopefully will be promoted.
 
Chewit said:
I agree with what you say re foundations and recruitment. It’s fundamental to future of club and it might be jetting Ross down, we don’t really know. In fact how do we measure at this stage if recruitment is failing? Usually with hindsight/review. To early then to judge this windows business. The January window however was a disaster. On paper however was it so illogical? Did we really think Leadbitter and Grigg would have so little impact. Did we think Burnley’s reserve centre half would not be as good as we already had. This was poor recruitment and indicative of us scrambling around the market desperately looking for people. Got to hope we are passed that phase and the recruitment foundations are in place now, but we won’t know for sure until the season progresses.
But agree it should underpin everything we do.
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When the manager has no vision on how he wants to play, then how can he or others know what type of players are needed to fill those needs? Our play is very erratic and so is our recruitment. That, to me, is not a solid foundation to build on.

In your estimate what does our team do well and what do you think Ross is trying to get them to do?
 
Morse said:
Ouch! :lol:

Right, obviously I’ve missed something.

We could’ve gone out of existence. Luckily, new owners came in, hired Ross and made funds available that the other L1 clubs could only dream of. Well done the owners.

Ross has come in, stated anything less than promotion is failure, and been given an enormous budget (bigger than all the other clubs combined) to build his squad.
He became known as the draw specialist, and seemed content to grind out points with unimaginative, boring, defensive football. We never really looked like finishing top, and neither did we really look a class above anyone we played. Teams who spent a tiny fraction of what we did in the transfer market regularly managed to match us, and a few beat us.
We finish 5th. 5th in L1. The worst finish in our entire history.

The owners keep Ross, maybe more because they didn’t want to pay him off than trusting him, but that’s conjecture.
He fails to address the issues we have, and we start the season at first as we left off.
We’ve had a few wins, including one very pleasing one at Portsmouth and a great cup win v Burnley. We aren’t looking convincing, but we pulled off some good results so far.

Given our spend, we really aren’t punching our weight, and Ross hasn’t managed to make his expensive squad shine like it should.

Anything there you disagree with?
Click to expand...

You got that spot on.
 
No7 said:
It's not though is it? 1 defeat and let's sack the manager? Give over
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It is because you’re selectively ignoring all other criteria. Poor summer recruitment, poor January recruitment, poor previous season finish, huge expenditure, dodgy, tentative football, crap post match excuses...

He should’ve been gone last May, but he’s had another summer to waste money and the fans’ time.
 
Morse said:
It is because you’re selectively ignoring all other criteria. Poor summer recruitment, poor January recruitment, poor previous season finish, huge expenditure, dodgy, tentative football, crap post match excuses...

He should’ve been gone last May, but he’s had another summer to waste money and the fans’ time.
Click to expand...

I'm not ignoring anything. I'm going off what's in front of me right now. Before our first defeat of the season, which happens in every league, we were joint top and progressed to the next round of the cup.

1 defeat and the pitchforks are out again :lol:
 
Morse said:
So Ross wasted all that money, while other teams in L1 manage just fine on scraps...
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Well for starters I don't put all our signings down to Ross , 75% of the budget went in grigg who the chairman admits was his choice (JR wanted Madison).
 
LineTrash said:
When the manager has no vision on how he wants to play, then how can he or others know what type of players are needed to fill those needs? Our play is very erratic and so is our recruitment. That, to me, is not a solid foundation to build on.

In your estimate what does our team do well and what do you think Ross is trying to get them to do?
Click to expand...

I think fear underpins everything the manager and players do. They are managing and playing for a premiership stature club. We if they had the mentality for this they would already be plying their trade in a higher division.
If it was easy to be a big club with a big budget Leeds would have been back in the prem years ago.
The opposition are treating each game like a cup tie, many fans are ready to pounce on failure on a match by match basis. We are still trying to balance the books.
The manager clearly had an idea of how he wants to play but cannot instill it in his team... is that because they are not good enough? Hence plan B.
All I know is we have to get out of this division and get some investment and I figure we have a lot of people from the manager to the players and owners who have more integrity than most who have represented our club in recent years.
Chopping and changing is unlikely to change anything. Worth a punt if we get out of touch but as we stand everyone needs to support this manager.... the club, the players and the fans. If all 3 fail him, then we will get all we deserve.
Remember weak players will let the manager take the flack if it’s being thrown around.
The manager is good enough at this stage, the players are so let’s give them every chance to deliver.
 
No7 said:
I'm not ignoring anything. I'm going off what's in front of me right now. Before our first defeat of the season, which happens in every league, we were joint top and progressed to the next round of the cup.

1 defeat and the pitchforks are out again :lol:
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The ‘pitchforks’ as you describe it, or ‘lack of faith in Ross’ to give it its proper name, has been unwavering for months. Nothing has changed. I wanted him out several weeks before the end of last season, I wanted him out before he had a chance to waste more money in the summer, and I still think he’s going to take us nowhere.
 
Morse said:
The ‘pitchforks’ as you describe it, or ‘lack of faith in Ross’ to give it its proper name, has been unwavering for months. Nothing has changed. I wanted him out several weeks before the end of last season, I wanted him out before he had a chance to waste more money in the summer, and I still think he’s going to take us nowhere.
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well thought out opinions on this board, christ we are in a new world now aren't we :lol: :lol:
Chop Sauce said:
What do you think? He’s lost the plot man.
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To be honest i think the plot wandered off sometime ago from him, he doesn't know where it is, just like his tactical master course books, he's lost them to.😄
 
Last edited by a moderator:
The day that you accept a 3-0 defeat away at Peterborough as ‘one of those things’ is the day you accept a potentially long stay In league 1.

If people are ok with that in the context that we nearly went bust, then fine.

I’m not ok with that tbh.
 
Marco20 said:
The day that you accept a 3-0 defeat away at Peterborough as ‘one of those things’ is the day you accept a potentially long stay In league 1.

If people are ok with that in the context that we nearly went bust, then fine.

I’m not ok with that tbh.
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Same here, i don't fancy becoming the next Leeds, 2004 they got relegated from the Premer league, having bloody good go at getting back their but still haven't done it yet.
jsdftm04 said:
Donald has said multiple times Ross asked for grigg
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This and on the Roker Report podcasts at least twice if i remember correctly.
 
Chewit said:
I think fear underpins everything the manager and players do. They are managing and playing for a premiership stature club. We if they had the mentality for this they would already be plying their trade in a higher division.
If it was easy to be a big club with a big budget Leeds would have been back in the prem years ago.
The opposition are treating each game like a cup tie, many fans are ready to pounce on failure on a match by match basis. We are still trying to balance the books.
The manager clearly had an idea of how he wants to play but cannot instill it in his team... is that because they are not good enough? Hence plan B.
All I know is we have to get out of this division and get some investment and I figure we have a lot of people from the manager to the players and owners who have more integrity than most who have represented our club in recent years.
Chopping and changing is unlikely to change anything. Worth a punt if we get out of touch but as we stand everyone needs to support this manager.... the club, the players and the fans. If all 3 fail him, then we will get all we deserve.
Remember weak players will let the manager take the flack if it’s being thrown around.
The manager is good enough at this stage, the players are so let’s give them every chance to deliver.
Click to expand...

You actually believe it’s the fans fault that we play horrible football?

I have nothing more to say to that... end of discussion for me.
 
Chewit said:
I think fear underpins everything the manager and players do. They are managing and playing for a premiership stature club. We if they had the mentality for this they would already be plying their trade in a higher division.
If it was easy to be a big club with a big budget Leeds would have been back in the prem years ago.
The opposition are treating each game like a cup tie, many fans are ready to pounce on failure on a match by match basis. We are still trying to balance the books.
The manager clearly had an idea of how he wants to play but cannot instill it in his team... is that because they are not good enough? Hence plan B.
All I know is we have to get out of this division and get some investment and I figure we have a lot of people from the manager to the players and owners who have more integrity than most who have represented our club in recent years.
Chopping and changing is unlikely to change anything. Worth a punt if we get out of touch but as we stand everyone needs to support this manager.... the club, the players and the fans. If all 3 fail him, then we will get all we deserve.
Remember weak players will let the manager take the flack if it’s being thrown around.
The manager is good enough at this stage, the players are so let’s give them every chance to deliver.
Click to expand...

I started the season like that tbh - but the first few games have shown we’ve not learned anything. We aren’t building anything here imho with this chap in charge. No lessons learned, same shite football and generally the same ‘top end but but not quite there’ results.

On that basis consistency of manager is irrelevant - he’s not building or learning
 

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