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Just watched that klitscko aj 5th round again. Aj looked like wilder. Staggering about.
The bloke hates getting hit properly ! He either stumbles into a clinch or loses his balance and visibly wobbles or blows out of his backside ! Cant remember ever seeing look angry when he got hit in a ‘ really you clipped me, i’m gonna clip you harder ‘ reaction he just panics and loses it ! Shame really
 
Been watching Lewis's fights as haven't really seen much, he had some power didn't he :) Never seen anyone as wild as Briggs for the first 2 rounds nearly finished Lewis off, checked Wiki and Briggs won about 35 fights in under 3 rounds
Briggs went on the Tomato can circuit to pad his record. Didn't help him down the line when he got to fighters who could handle his power and he had no plan B. Was lucky to get the nod over a 46 year old Foreman, prob should have lost tbh.

Lewis was quality though, you look at his resume and he makes today's lads look laughable at the challenges they have taken so far.
 
Been watching Lewis's fights as haven't really seen much, he had some power didn't he :) Never seen anyone as wild as Briggs for the first 2 rounds nearly finished Lewis off, checked Wiki and Briggs won about 35 fights in under 3 rounds
I keep banging on about that fight. Its an absolute cracker.

IIRC, Briggs was the Lineal Champion at one point. Might have been that fight actually. I think he beat Foreman, but the belts had been stripped beforehand or something?
 
I keep banging on about that fight. Its an absolute cracker.

IIRC, Briggs was the Lineal Champion at one point. Might have been that fight actually. I think he beat Foreman, but the belts had been stripped beforehand or something?
Foreman dropped the belts so he could fight the likes of Axel Schultz and Crawford Geinsley instead of Bowe, Holyfield, Tyson, Lewis etc and paraded around as Lineal Champion (a made up meaningless championship that doesn't exist).

Briggs then beat him via a robbery and fought Lewis losing the fake title to the actual real champion.



Sky supposedly doing Marshall v TBA and Shield v TBA plus Williams v Eubank as a PPV. About as laughable as it comes tbh, makes Bellew v Cleverly PPV look absolutely legit.

Sky should really just let MTK take over their boxing and they'd put some decent fights on.

I know there's the hoohah with Daniel Kinahan but they are happy to let Newcastles Taliban Army on TV and cheerlead for them so may as well put the cartel on as well.
 
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Foreman dropped the belts so he could fight the likes of Axel Schultz and Crawford Geinsley instead of Bowe, Holyfield, Tyson, Lewis etc and paraded around as Lineal Champion (a made up meaningless championship that doesn't exist).
In fairness, all the ABC belts are made up. Someone made a company up, then created a title, then invited people to pay for the priviledge of fighting for that title.
They're all made up. The question is, which is the most important*

The belts that can be won and lost in a courtroom, or stripped because a fighter gets an injury. Or the one where you have to beat the man.


For me, probably the Ring Magazine #1 rating.
 
In fairness, all the ABC belts are made up. Someone made a company up, then created a title, then invited people to pay for the priviledge of fighting for that title.
They're all made up. The question is, which is the most important*

The belts that can be won and lost in a courtroom, or stripped because a fighter gets an injury. Or the one where you have to beat the man.


For me, probably the Ring Magazine #1 rating.
Yes but Lineal is made up in the fact that it's not a title, it doesn't have rankings, it has no manadatorys and doesn't mean anything. It's fabricated in every way.

Not the sanctioning bodies are shit and getting worse by the day but at least their is a competitive element to them, you have to fight your manadatorys (as shit as some of them are) and are required to fight a decent level of competition (mostly) to keep the title. That's obviously watered down in the four+ belt era but I'd rather have that than people claiming they are the champ and then fighting guys not in the top 100 for years on end.

The fighter makes the belts now, they make it by who they fight and prove whose best.

I'd say the only legit champions in boxing currently are Josh Taylor and Naoya Inoue. The rest have question marks to answer.
 
Yes but Lineal is made up in the fact that it's not a title, it doesn't have rankings, it has no manadatorys and doesn't mean anything. It's fabricated in every way.
Rankings, mandatories - all things that were made up rules.
You said you didn't like things that were made up.

Whoever beat the man who beat the man is the lineal champ. That's all it means. Take what you want from that.
 
Rankings, mandatories - all things that were made up rules.
You said you didn't like things that were made up.

Whoever beat the man who beat the man is the lineal champ. That's all it means. Take what you want from that.
By that though Tunney is still the man.

Beating the man who beat the man only works if the man is willing to fight. If not you move on.

It's neigh on impossible to become a lineal champion as well, only Usyk, Crawford, Taylor and Hopkins have been able to start a lineal claim in the last twenty years and two of those immediately moved weight so it couldn't be carried on.

Fury claims it but Wlad was never a true lineal champion as he never fully unified or beat his number 2 so it isn't really true in his case either.

That's why it's a shambles. Not that the sanctioning bodies are any better and Ring took a drop when it was bought by Golden Boy, became more biased to their own fighters and changed the conditions on winning the belt. It's still probably better than the rest by a fair margin mind.
 
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Yes but Lineal is made up in the fact that it's not a title, it doesn't have rankings, it has no manadatorys and doesn't mean anything. It's fabricated in every way.

Not the sanctioning bodies are shit and getting worse by the day but at least their is a competitive element to them, you have to fight your manadatorys (as shit as some of them are) and are required to fight a decent level of competition (mostly) to keep the title. That's obviously watered down in the four+ belt era but I'd rather have that than people claiming they are the champ and then fighting guys not in the top 100 for years on end.

The fighter makes the belts now, they make it by who they fight and prove whose best.

I'd say the only legit champions in boxing currently are Josh Taylor and Naoya Inoue. The rest have question marks to answer.
Would you not class Canelo as a legit current champion?
 
Yes but Lineal is made up in the fact that it's not a title, it doesn't have rankings, it has no manadatorys and doesn't mean anything. It's fabricated in every way.

Not the sanctioning bodies are shit and getting worse by the day but at least their is a competitive element to them, you have to fight your manadatorys (as shit as some of them are) and are required to fight a decent level of competition (mostly) to keep the title. That's obviously watered down in the four+ belt era but I'd rather have that than people claiming they are the champ and then fighting guys not in the top 100 for years on end.

The fighter makes the belts now, they make it by who they fight and prove whose best.

I'd say the only legit champions in boxing currently are Josh Taylor and Naoya Inoue. The rest have question marks to answer.
That’s just opinion.

I could add Lopez, canelo, Tyson, bredis , Estrada, spencer, etc. Opinions
Would you not class Canelo as a legit current champion?
Lots of legit champions and it’s been like this for 45 plus year. No new news.

And lineal is just a term that’s pretty much as
close as it can be. I certainly wouldn’t take it too literal and get passionate about it.
Would you not class Canelo as a legit current champion?
Btw I assume that’s rhetorical. If anyone debates this then I give up. 😉
 
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Often wondered if there was something that could be done to make the 4 big governing bodies work together.

Have an undisputed title that's held above the other titles so

WBC Undisputed world champion

WBA
WBO
IBF world champions

WBC world champion (can't fight for undisputed title)

Undisputed champion has to defend against one of the world's with whoever the loser is dropping their belt. If the WBC Undisputed champion loses it becomes the WBA undisputed champion etc.

Pie in the sky talk because governing bodies would have to work together but would make for big fights.
 
Often wondered if there was something that could be done to make the 4 big governing bodies work together.

Have an undisputed title that's held above the other titles so

WBC Undisputed world champion

WBA
WBO
IBF world champions

WBC world champion (can't fight for undisputed title)

Undisputed champion has to defend against one of the world's with whoever the loser is dropping their belt. If the WBC Undisputed champion loses it becomes the WBA undisputed champion etc.

Pie in the sky talk because governing bodies would have to work together but would make for big fights.

Not a chance. There's too many people making money from the set up as it is.

The second you have an 'overall' belt that devalues the others, they don't make as much money from the alphabet belts.
 
Often wondered if there was something that could be done to make the 4 big governing bodies work together.

Have an undisputed title that's held above the other titles so

WBC Undisputed world champion

WBA
WBO
IBF world champions

WBC world champion (can't fight for undisputed title)

Undisputed champion has to defend against one of the world's with whoever the loser is dropping their belt. If the WBC Undisputed champion loses it becomes the WBA undisputed champion etc.

Pie in the sky talk because governing bodies would have to work together but would make for big fights.
The ABC governing bodies don't want that. They want all the titles to be separate. Remember how they make money!
 
Would you not class Canelo as a legit current champion?
He will be if he beats Plant.

At middleweight most thought he list to GGG and you also had claims from Charlo and Andrade (even if weaker claims) and at LHW well he didnt

SMW was pretty weak with no out and out champion so defeating Smith and Saunders ain't really enough considering Smith had one good win and Saunders hadn't beaten a top ten ranked opponent at the weight.
That’s just opinion.

I could add Lopez, canelo, Tyson, bredis , Estrada, spencer, etc. Opinions

Lots of legit champions and it’s been like this for 45 plus year. No new news.

And lineal is just a term that’s pretty much as
close as it can be. I certainly wouldn’t take it too literal and get passionate about it.

Btw I assume that’s rhetorical. If anyone debates this then I give up. 😉
I would ass Lopez tbf, forgot about him.

Estarda needs to beat Gonzalez cleanly, last fight I felt he lost pretty clearly.

Fury needs to fight Usyk to claim it. He could have claimed it when he beat Wlad but then he got banned for two years and it was reset. Both him and Joshua had a claim that passed onto Usyk so they can fight to be champion.

Spence needs to fight Crawford. Think everyone agrees with that.

Breidis maybes, he lost to Gevor though and I'd like to see him avenge that and beat Okolie before I'd class him as outright man of the division.

You can class them all as champions but you rarely get an outright champion of a division since the 3/4 belt era. Three belt era used to get a lot more though, politics has held the sport back a lot since the WBO was recognised in the mid 00s.
 
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To me, for no real reason, I always value them in order as; Ring magazine, WBC, WBA, WBO, IBF. No idea why, just how I view them.
He will be if he beats Plant.

At middleweight most thought he list to GGG and you also had claims from Charlo and Andrade (even if weaker claims) and at LHW well he didnt

SMW was pretty weak with no out and out champion so defeating Smith and Saunders ain't really enough considering Smith had one good win and Saunders hadn't beaten a top ten ranked opponent at the weight.

I would ass Lopez tbf, forgot about him.

Estarda needs to beat Gonzalez cleanly, last fight I felt he lost pretty clearly.

Fury needs to fight Usyk to claim it. He could have claimed it when he beat Wlad but then he got banned for two years and it was reset. Both him and Joshua had a claim that passed onto Usyk so they can fight to be champion.

Spence needs to fight Crawford. Think everyone agrees with that.

Breidis maybes, he lost to Gevor though and I'd like to see him avenge that and beat Okolie before I'd class him as outright man of the division.

You can class them all as champions but you rarely get an outright champion of a division since the 3/4 belt era. Three belt era used to get a lot more though, politics has held the sport back a lot since the WBO was recognised in the mid 00s.
So basically you just mean an undisputed champion in a lot more words?
Breidis defo doesn’t have to prove himself against Okolie
 
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He will be if he beats Plant.

At middleweight most thought he list to GGG and you also had claims from Charlo and Andrade (even if weaker claims) and at LHW well he didnt

SMW was pretty weak with no out and out champion so defeating Smith and Saunders ain't really enough considering Smith had one good win and Saunders hadn't beaten a top ten ranked opponent at the weight.

I would ass Lopez tbf, forgot about him.

Estarda needs to beat Gonzalez cleanly, last fight I felt he lost pretty clearly.

Fury needs to fight Usyk to claim it. He could have claimed it when he beat Wlad but then he got banned for two years and it was reset. Both him and Joshua had a claim that passed onto Usyk so they can fight to be champion.

Spence needs to fight Crawford. Think everyone agrees with that.

Breidis maybes, he lost to Gevor though and I'd like to see him avenge that and beat Okolie before I'd class him as outright man of the division.

You can class them all as champions but you rarely get an outright champion of a division since the 3/4 belt era. Three belt era used to get a lot more though, politics has held the sport back a lot since the WBO was recognised in the mid 00s.
Just opinions marra. Could go on all day.

if you are saying they have to be undisputed
To be the champion then good luck. We’ll have a handful every ten year. There are some incredible fighters over the last 30 years you can claim weren’t champions in that premise. It just gets daft And unrealistic and not the fighters fault a lot of the time.
Ill Continue to have my personal view and Canelo and the ones I mentioned are the champions.
 

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