Flat Earthers

[taipeisafc]

So basically you are arguing the world is not a globe, it is not something else that people are trying to cover up, you think you know the truth but can't tell us what it is?

@Cockney Mackem - What I said in my reply to you a couple of days ago. I thought I'd try it and engage, and if you look at every response to what I have asked in this bit of discussion and the others running, all designed to invite more questions. "Please tell us wise old sage", yet none of them actually say anything. Attack the model accepted by the sane or anyone who has ever done any sensible level of observation of the night sky or world around them but actually offer very little in return. It is a curious trait of the CT.

Look at the phrase above "but you need to try and find out the rest from my side before .....". It is literally a beg for more information, to ask the question for the third time and that 6 other posters have asked. "Please keep asking me the question again, it makes me feel like a hero".

He is a moron i cannot be arsed with him anymore

 

[Danny]

Who cares?

 

[MickeyV]

I watched 'Beyond the Curve' and the comments about some people desperately seeking evidence that supports their own unscientific theories, and the Dunning- Krueger effect displayed by flat-earthers, led me to look into some historical investigations which I present here as a simple story.
The Greeks worked out 2500 years ago that the earth is a sphere, because they looked up. In the day there was a round sun and at night there was a 'round' moon that looked 3D, and very occasionally the shadow of the earth showed as an outline on the moon. Simple deduction told them that the earth was a sphere like the sun and moon, but we had to wait until Galileo and his telescope 2000 years later to work out we were not at the centre. This is the '500 years' that flat-earthers often quote in their deranged conspiracy rants, but inconvenient facts don't change closed minds.
2250 years ago, a Greek called Eratosthenes looked down a well in southern Egypt at mid-day on the summer solstice, and saw the sun reflected in the water below, so he sussed that the sun was directly overhead. Next midsummer he was in Alexandria, so he plonked a stick vertically on the ground and measured the length of its shadow. Knowing the length of the stick, he was able to work out the angle of the sun at about 7.2 degrees, or about one 50th of a circle. He had paid attention in geometry class! Erato knew it was about 500 miles from the well at Aswan to Alexandria, so he calculated 50x500 = 25,000 miles which turned out to be a pretty accurate stab it the circumference of the world.
There were some clever buggers around all that time ago. We have known this stuff for over two millennia, which is a long time to keep a conspiracy going!

 

[Nukehasslefan]

Yes, I'd figured out the earth's shape and why it was thus in junior school.

Because you were schooled into that belief, like we all were.

Physics O level is all you need in near earth space.

So, what does that explain?

Space, especially deep space, is another matter for which you need an understanding of cosmology and the ability to take a leap of faith.

I agree. It comes down to faith.

We may even agree on some of that

Yep.

Call them whatever you like - stars, points of light, it doesn't matter - the motion of them that you can observe yourself only makes sense if the world is a rotating globe. Even with the most convoluted set of mirrors, the motion can't be explained if the Earth is considered to be disc-shaped or part of a dome.

They don't only make sense if the world is a rotating globe. They make sense to you because you follow that train of thought.
You're welcome to that, obviously but I beg to differ.

Doesn't believe in relativity, laws of motion, 4 fundamental forces of physics or see any evidence of gravity but believes the earth is a giant dart board covered in a snow dome despite no evidence.

Canny.

I think you'll find Dave mentioned the dartboard. And the laws of motion come down to one thing. Equal reaction to action.
That's it.
The others either make no sense or answer the very same thing.

If that was the case could you not stand on the so called equator with a telescope and see the stars spinning different ways.

Depending which was looking?

depending on where you are to see a mirroring of the points of light.

So basically you are arguing the world is not a globe, it is not something else that people are trying to cover up, you think you know the truth but can't tell us what it is?

I don't know the truth of what the earth is, I just know what it isn't. I have my own theory as to what it may be.
As for people trying to cover up real earth for the globe. Most are simply following a set out pattern/model, in my opinion and just go with the mass flow, which is basically what we seem to do with everything in life.
Follow a narrative en masse.

The earth has effectively been proven to be a globe just as gravitational force has been proven to be a ting.

No, it hasn't.
You may think it has and that's fine for you. I don't think any globe or gravity has been shown to be factual.

Scientists have attempted to disprove the above but have failed.

It is therefore an accepted scientific fact.

Of course it's accepted as a scientific fact.
That's why we were/are all schooled into it.

I watched 'Beyond the Curve' and the comments about some people desperately seeking evidence that supports their own unscientific theories, and the Dunning- Krueger effect displayed by flat-earthers, led me to look into some historical investigations which I present here as a simple story.
The Greeks worked out 2500 years ago that the earth is a sphere, because they looked up. In the day there was a round sun and at night there was a 'round' moon that looked 3D, and very occasionally the shadow of the earth showed as an outline on the moon. Simple deduction told them that the earth was a sphere like the sun and moon, but we had to wait until Galileo and his telescope 2000 years later to work out we were not at the centre. This is the '500 years' that flat-earthers often quote in their deranged conspiracy rants, but inconvenient facts don't change closed minds.
2250 years ago, a Greek called Eratosthenes looked down a well in southern Egypt at mid-day on the summer solstice, and saw the sun reflected in the water below, so he sussed that the sun was directly overhead. Next midsummer he was in Alexandria, so he plonked a stick vertically on the ground and measured the length of its shadow. Knowing the length of the stick, he was able to work out the angle of the sun at about 7.2 degrees, or about one 50th of a circle. He had paid attention in geometry class! Erato knew it was about 500 miles from the well at Aswan to Alexandria, so he calculated 50x500 = 25,000 miles which turned out to be a pretty accurate stab it the circumference of the world.
There were some clever buggers around all that time ago. We have known this stuff for over two millennia, which is a long time to keep a conspiracy going!

And to think those stories are far and wide and people actually still use them as some kind of argument for a spinning globe.

 

[cosmicchris00]

My schooling made sense because its obviously true.

Science may be beyond your comprehension but the more most people see the more it makes sense, apart from quantum physics.

If you suspend belief in science you may as well believe all the old testament fairy tales i.e. T-rex died out the day before yesterday, in geological terms, despite their fossilised remains clearly indicating otherwise.

When it comes to 99% of accepted science, the facts are; it simply can't not be true.

 

[Nukehasslefan]

My schooling made sense because its obviously true.

Of course your schooling makes sense. Why wouldn't it?
You go into school as a willing learner, generally. Peer pressure ensures you try to keep up or you are, maybe, simply a person who can memorise stuff much more than others.

The issue is, you can memorise the potential truth just as easily as you could memorise potential misinformation and yet your requirements are to regurgitate all of that onto an exam sheet for the reward of a certificate.
Which s all fair enough but it doesn't mean you learned whole truth's all of the time.

Science may be beyond your comprehension but the more most people see the more it makes sense, apart from quantum physics.

If science is beyond our comprehension then we look for potentials of what everything maybe be.
Or do you mean so called scientists spew out lots of stuff which nobody can comprehend?

If you suspend belief in science you may as well believe all the old testament fairy tales i.e.

Everything we do is a science.
It's not suspending a belief in science it's questioning what could very well be pseudo science told by so called experts in that so called field.
We likely do believe in a lot of fairy tales.
The issue is in finding the fact from the fiction.
Some accept most things as fact if told by someone who they are coaxed into believing, are experts on the matter.

T-rex died out the day before yesterday, in geological terms, despite their fossilised remains clearly indicating otherwise.

Told by the story tellers.

When it comes to 99% of accepted science, the facts are; it simply can't not be true.

In your mind, maybe.
The reasons for that are whatever reasons you believe are valid to you.

 

[fyl2u]

They don't only make sense if the world is a rotating globe. They make sense to you because you follow that train of thought.
You're welcome to that, obviously but I beg to differ.

How can you disagree with how simple motion works? You can test it in whatever room you're in right now.

Switch on the light and stand slightly back from it, then turn around a full circle while looking directly above your head. The light will appear to move in a circle in the opposite direction.

Now get a lamp that has a light at head height and do the same thing. The light will make a straight path.

Now put a light at your feet and do it again. The light will trace a reverse path to the one above your head.

This isn't rocket science, it's stuff every toddler can get their heads around.

 

[Nukehasslefan]

How can you disagree with how simple motion works? You can test it in whatever room you're in right now.

Switch on the light and stand slightly back from it, then turn around a full circle while looking directly above your head. The light will appear to move in a circle in the opposite direction.

Now get a lamp that has a light at head height and do the same thing. The light will make a straight path.

Now put a light at your feet and do it again. The light will trace a reverse path to the one above your head.

This isn't rocket science, it's stuff every toddler can get their heads around.

I have no idea what you're getting at.

 

[fyl2u]

I have no idea what you're getting at.

I can tell.

I don't know how to put it in any plainer terms for you.


Look up at night. Stars move in circles.

Go to Australia and look up at night. Stars move in circles in the opposite direction. Different stars.

Go to equator and look up at night. Stars move in straight lines not circles. You can see both sets of stars previously mentioned, in opposite sides of the sky.


Explain this motion for an earth that is any shape other than a globe.

 

[Nukehasslefan]

I can tell.

I don't know how to put it in any plainer terms for you.


Look up at night. Stars move in circles.

Go to Australia and look up at night. Stars move in circles in the opposite direction. Different stars.

Go to equator and look up at night. Stars move in straight lines not circles. You can see both sets of stars previously mentioned, in opposite sides of the sky.


Explain this motion for an earth that is any shape other than a globe.

Mirrored.
You see some points of light, not all points of light.

It depends where you are stood as to what you see in terms of mirroring.
Most points of light appear to rise and set, so hardly going around in circles to your immediate vision.


Or are you going by time lapse?.

 

[The Truth]

Some people were born to be picked up by a cult

 

[fyl2u]

Mirrored.
You see some points of light, not all points of light.

It depends where you are stood as to what you see in terms of mirroring.
Most points of light appear to rise and set, so hardly going around in circles to your immediate vision.


Or are you going by time lapse?.

Mirroring light sources from where, when you can clearly see that the same stars don't exist "north" of the mirroring effect?
What shape are these mirrors?
Why do the mirrors only exist in the southern hemisphere?
How do you achieve the effect on the equator that the stars move in straight lines using mirroring?

It's utter drivel. None of this can be explained with mirroring, no matter what shape the mirrors are.

 

[Wild Card]

Even without getting technical, you can literally walk from the east of Russia to the west of America. How would that be possible if the earth was flat?

Also gravity pulls all matter towards it and the most efficient way is a sphere, that way all matter is as close as possible to the centre. Its what had happened to every other formed planet in observable universe.

 

[Nukehasslefan]

Mirroring light sources from where, when you can clearly see that the same stars don't exist "north" of the mirroring effect?
What shape are these mirrors?

The dome is the mirror. In my opinion, of course.

Why do the mirrors only exist in the southern hemisphere?

There is no southern hemisphere from my mindset.

How do you achieve the effect on the equator that the stars move in straight lines using mirroring?

Lights just moving over the dome from where you are at a certain area. You know, like moving over to look like they set as people understand how the sun supposedly does.

It's utter drivel. None of this can be explained with mirroring, no matter what shape the mirrors are.

Then you have no need to accept it. I gave you my answer and you don't agree. Fair enough.

 

[fyl2u]

The dome is the mirror. In my opinion, of course.

There is no southern hemisphere from my mindset.

Lights just moving over the dome from where you are at a certain area. You know, like moving over to look like they set as people understand how the sun supposedly does.

Then you have no need to accept it. I gave you my answer and you don't agree. Fair enough.

You gave your answer and it's utter nonsense, like if we were discussing what 2+2 was, and you said "well, you asked my opinion, I said 1673456893gdalkjhj£&^£%&664829982klkjdlk3835987bubblegum5373829@;'4093£%(%*-0gjpso3985aliens32589dsskigkhje and you disagree. That's fair enough".

 

[Nukehasslefan]

Even without getting technical, you can literally walk from the east of Russia to the west of America. How would that be possible if the earth was flat?

What has walking got to do with a spinning globe?

Also gravity pulls all matter towards it and the most efficient way is a sphere, that way all matter is as close as possible to the centre.

When looked at a bit deeper, there no such thing as a pulling force, in my opinion.
It's all push. All compression. All pressure. All friction and frequency with those compressing pressures depending on energy applied.

If all matter went to the centre of Earth there would be no crushing up of a helium balloon. It should be pulled down according to the so called gravity explanation.

Its what had happened to every other formed planet in observable universe.

So people are told. And that's all it is....a story told.

You gave your answer and it's utter nonsense, like if we were discussing what 2+2 was, and you said "well, you asked my opinion, I said 1673456893gdalkjhj£&^£%&664829982klkjdlk3835987bubblegum5373829@;'4093£%(%*-0gjpso3985aliens32589dsskigkhje and you disagree. That's fair enough".

To me that's what you're giving, so it is what it is.

 

[Wild Card]

What has walking got to do with a spinning globe?



When looked at a bit deeper, there no such thing as a pulling force, in my opinion.
It's all push. All compression. All pressure. All friction and frequency with those compressing pressures depending on energy applied.

If all matter went to the centre of Earth there would be no crushing up of a helium balloon. It should be pulled down according to the so called gravity explanation.


So people are told. And that's all it is....a story told.

To me that's what you're giving, so it is what it is.

What has walking got to do with a spinning globe?



When looked at a bit deeper, there no such thing as a pulling force, in my opinion.
It's all push. All compression. All pressure. All friction and frequency with those compressing pressures depending on energy applied.

If all matter went to the centre of Earth there would be no crushing up of a helium balloon. It should be pulled down according to the so called gravity explanation.


So people are told. And that's all it is....a story told.

To me that's what you're giving, so it is what it is.

My point re the walking was that, if the earth was flat you wouldnt be able to walk from the east of Russia head east to the west of America. Then continue east, cross the Atlantic(obvs not walking) to mainland Europe and eventually end back up at Eastern Russia. Which is all very possible.

As for your detailed thesis on why gravity doesn't exist, put it on here, I will happily give it an objective read. Science should always be questioned.

 

[Nukehasslefan]

My point re the walking was that, if the earth was flat you wouldnt be able to walk from the east of Russia head east to the west of America. Then continue east, cross the Atlantic(obvs not walking) to mainland Europe and eventually end back up at Eastern Russia. Which is all very possible.

Are we talking using a compass?
If so then following east would take you around a circle.

East on your globe would also be taking you around a circle, only your circle would be curved as you are told.

As for your detailed thesis on why gravity doesn't exist, put it on here, I will happily give it an objective read. Science should always be questioned.

Gravity for me is very simple. It's atmospheric pressure.
The arguments come is as if gravity is responsible for atmospheric pressure and that gravity is separate.
The weird part is, nobody can explain what gravity is and yet there it is, literally right in our faces and bodies as the pressure we are under but take for granted as being nothing.

 

[BigPete]

depending on where you are to see a mirroring of the points of light.

So there is a spot where you can see this?

Why has nobody every been there to prove it then?

 

[Nukehasslefan]

So there is a spot where you can see this?

Why has nobody every been there to prove it then?

Prove what?