RR EXCLUSIVE: Charlie Methven discusses Sunderland’s investment, transfer window & scouting plans

Agree with Rocky. It shouldn’t have taken 18 months to start putting the Scouting back in place.

And this extensive overhaul? Tony Coton who has presided over 3 poor transfer windows, Hill, Reid and a Scandinavian scout who worked with Coton at Villa. He mentions one working in the Midlands (another Coton link) and someone else who might come in.

I just personally don’t have any trust that this lot are the “best we can be”. Charlie’s own words when he took over

The people you mention are just the "overseers". Each of them will have extensive teams of scouts working under them. So far they've been trying to organise a plan for a whole network while also trying to do the jobs of that whole network themselves at the same time. Hardly surprising that the range from which we've recruited players so far has been less than admirable.

Putting the scouting back in place takes money, and quite a bit of it. That money would mean the books would have been harder to balance, which in turn would have made it harder to attract investment.

We now have the investment we were looking for, and so we've reached the next phase in the redesign of the whole club structure, the rebuilding.

I'm happy to see the wheels in motion for us to be better than we are.

If we'd managed to secure the investment faster, then maybe the scouting network would have been rebuilt faster, but if 18 months is what it takes to put together a comprehensive plan in order to do things properly, then I'd rather they took that long than did a slap-happy botch job in a shorter timeframe.

If something's worth doing, it's worth doing right. If it's worth doing right, it's worth taking your time over it rather than rushing it.
 


After hearing CM talk about the process that went into hiring a new manager, I'm content that they hired the person that they perceived to be the best candidate.

When it comes down to it, it doesn't matter who they hired, someone on here would be unhappy about it. Personally I would have been unhappy if they'd given it to Phillips, whereas quite a number of posters were crying out for us to hire him. The same can be said of every realistic candidate. According to CM in that podcast, not only did Parkinson have three promotions from this division under his belt as well as having kept Colchester punching two divisions above their weight in the Championship and Bolton managing to stay up despite a two year transfer embargo, but also when they spoke to people who have worked with him in various different capacities, the references were overwhelmingly positive, to the extent where CM says he's "never seen such a unanimous positive set of references for someone they were thinking of hiring for any position".

That's a good enough explanation for me for why they hired him. If all that is true, and I have no reason to suspect otherwise, then I probably would have hired him too, even though he wasn't even on my radar before we hired him.

With regard to threats and abuse, again CM explains in the podcast that it's not just the abuse and threats, it's the unpleasantness and the aggression with which people were talking to them. As he says, questioning them is absolutely fine, but if someone's asking questions in an aggressive and unpleasant manner, that's something different entirely.

I can completely relate, having found myself on the wrong end of unpleasantness and aggression on here myself. Hell, I'm no angel myself, I've been unpleasant and aggressive to people on here myself, and it's something I'm ashamed of and am trying to correct but I'm aware I haven't fully shaken the habit yet. I'd like to think that any other people on here who have also been guilty of it will at some point go through the same thought process, but I fear that for some it's a level of self-examination they're probably not capable of. Their aggression and unpleasantness is just innate.

I've also found myself wondering at times whether I should just stay off this forum, as the vast majority of the time it doesn't make me happy to be here. At the moment there are still a slack handful of posters that I enjoy engaging with, and that keeps me here, but I have to say at the moment it seems like there are quite a lot more people on here that I don't want to engage with than there are people I do want to engage with. Perhaps one day I'll reach tipping point and just stop coming here. I don't think that day is far off if things continue on here the way they have been recently.

As such, I have no problem with SD staying away from social media, and it makes me sad that SD feels like he doesn't want to be in the stadium on matchdays at the moment because of the way people have been interacting with him. Hopefully they manage to turn things around to the point where he feels comfortable coming back at some point soon. I certainly don't see it as "convenient", whatever that means. If attending means he gets grief that he wouldn't get from not attending, then maybe staying away is his best option. It doesn't exactly make me proud to be a fan when our chairman feels that way though.

With regard to the on-field performances and the squad, of course I'm not happy. Of course I want to see improvement. That can't happen until January though, and CM has stated that he and SD already planned to back Parkinson in the January window before the new investment came in, so it has no bearing on that plat whatsoever. So, if money is available to strengthen the squad in January, why get angry that money is also available to improve the facilities and scouting network? It makes no sense to me at all.
Given their track record for signings in their tenure what makes you so confident in January that they'll suddenly get it right ? You're unwavering admiration for SD and CM is admirable but as I die hard fan too I can't embrace them for the way they are conducting themselves at the moment and couldn't forgive CM for his utterly crass fan comments post Charlton. Now listening to that podcast he's shouting us down again !!
 
Sounds like it’s a matter of time before they take the academy to a cat 2 or cat 3. “We’d still have an academy and still be producing players at cat 3”. Absolutely terrifying the direction they are taking this club.

Weird, that's not what I heard at all. Sounded to me like they were proud to have a Cat 1 academy and he was just saying "we could have gone down this route, but we thought it was better to remain cat 1 and that's the absolute plan for the future of the academy too."
 
Sounds like it’s a matter of time before they take the academy to a cat 2 or cat 3. “We’d still have an academy and still be producing players at cat 3”. Absolutely terrifying the direction they are taking this club.

Must admit I'm not really up on what difference there is between the categories. In some ways it does seem a bit daft if it genuinely costs us £2m a year to be category A (or 1 or whatever) and we still have no protection when decent youngsters are poached at 15 so all we get is the ones no one else wants, who are unlikely to be mint. Mind you always have to read between the lines, Methven said it's about £2m a year for cat A, but we might not save much by dropping a category or 2, there'd presumably still need to be a lot of staff, similar running costs etc
 
Sounds like it’s a matter of time before they take the academy to a cat 2 or cat 3. “We’d still have an academy and still be producing players at cat 3”. Absolutely terrifying the direction they are taking this club.
We’d get even less money in compensation though. If any of the players who have left end up playing first team football we get more money again as cat1.
I can see the argument about not being cat 1 though.
 
Weird, that's not what I heard at all. Sounded to me like they were proud to have a Cat 1 academy and he was just saying "we could have gone down this route, but we thought it was better to remain cat 1 and that's the absolute plan for the future of the academy too."
Why talk about how it would be the same if we dropped then. They will do it eventually.
 
Given their track record for signings in their tenure what makes you so confident in January that they'll suddenly get it right ? You're unwavering admiration for SD and CM is admirable but as I die hard fan too I can't embrace them for the way they are conducting themselves at the moment and couldn't forgive CM for his utterly crass fan comments post Charlton. Now listening to that podcast he's shouting us down again !!

It's not admiration that I have for them, it's just that I don't have any reason not to trust them. I certainly don't have any reason to get angry with them or to be unpleasant to them in any way, and I don't have such a high opinion of my own view of the situation that I feel like I should be questioning their every move with aggression the way some people have chosen to.

He's not shouting everyone down. He says repeatedly it's a tiny minority that are being unpleasant and that he feels that 98% of the fanbase are fantastic people, he's just requesting that folks be civil when they question them, rather than charging in with "unpleasantness and aggression".
Why talk about how it would be the same if we dropped then. They will do it eventually.

He was just talking about it being one of the decisions they made when they arrived. When they came in they were looking at every aspect of the club for how they could cut costs, and if they'd chosen to drop the category of the academy it would have saved them millions a year, but they chose not to because they believe in the academy's ability to produce in the long-term, and they've got long-term hopes and plans for the club that wouldn't be helped by dropping to Cat 2 or 3.
 
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Charlie is embarrassing. Talking about the u23s if they pull back the likes of Hume, Robson & Embleton. Erm they played last season against Newcastle u23s and lost 5-0. Honestly can’t stand Charlie he’s so blasé and such a bullshitter. Get them away from the club
 
The way it’s looking to me is their luck has run out. If we don’t make promotion this season we are f*cked. If we do make promotion (unlikely) and no one is interested, we are equally as f*cked. Gates will fall dramatically and what else will there be to sell, only the infrastructure. I am looking carefully at the planning Policy Guidelines, nice expensive houses on the academy would be lucrative, jus a passing thought you understand.
 
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I think that might be a bit harsh. Again, these podcasts are totally voluntary on behalf of the club, if RR go on like Jeremy Paxman the club will simply stop doing them and we'll get nowt. I did think this was a bit of a "soft" podcast, and the interviewer was a bit full of the "good point Charlie, completely agree Charlie, oh when you put it like that Charlie" but maybe the kid gloves were partly because Donald has stepped away from doing them so they didn't want this one to be confrontational or else it might be the last one they get. You can argue whether they're worth it at all if they're going to be a PR exercise but you still get some good stuff out of it.

I would say fair play to Paul Reid mind, I'm sure being asked to come on a podcast in the current situation is probably well out of his comfort zone and I thought he answered well considering and explained things as well as he could without ever sounding condescending. Most in his role probably never have to come and address the fans and likely feel they're defending their role so I have a lot of respect for him doing it.

I even thought the Methven comments about how the investment will be spent was better when listening to it than it read in the quotes. It didn't sound like he was saying that's what the investment is for, it was more about how we've had to cut things back so some other stuff has been left a bit and that this is the point we can now start addressing it all.

We'll have to see what actually happens, how we do in January, how Parkinson gets the side playing, the further details about the fan experience stuff will be interesting much though we all know what happens on the pitch is the important bit. It was a soft, slightly PR driven podcast, but I thought it was interesting enough. Being honest I prefer hearing from Methven, there's a bit more clarity there than you get from Donald
Exactly mate ,said earlier on before i went for my cheap chicken at lidl,lets see what january brings.Will be interesting if they bring in m maddison and others be a right laugh on here.
 
The way it’s looking to me is their luck has run out. If we don’t make promotion this season we are f*cked. If we do make promotion (unlikely) and no one is interested, we are equally as f*cked. Gates will fall dramatically and what else will there be to sell, only the infrastructure. I am looking carefully at the planning Policy Guidelines, nice expensive houses on the academy would be lucrative, jus a passing thought you understand.

Not enough rich mags to buy them.
 
Have people actually listened to it?

I thought Reid spoke well, very honest and it makes you understand how difficult it is for the club to hold on to talented players. The U16 teams are all performing well, one age group U13s or U14s are national champions. Methven added that yes the results are not good at U23 and U18 level, however that's when our local lads if you will are beginning to compete against Premier League academies that have players playing for them from all over the world. He added that as a club they've made a decision to loan out our more talented players e.g. Robson, Diamond, Embleton etc. If they were all playing in our U23 side, if Hume was playing in the side also and Gooch etc. we'd obviously be winning more games, but ultimately it's not about that, it's about bringing on players that can contribute to the first team.

I know it's hardly groundbreaking, we probably already knew it, but it does highlight the difficulties the club has, regardless of who is running it and how much money they have.

It costs the club circa £2m each year to maintain the category one status.
 
I read what you posted, I just disagree.

From day one their priority was stripping everything back to bare bones. The existing scouting system needed chucking out and starting again because it was a:shit (we weren't exactly getting loads of great players in before SD/CM arrived were we?) and b: were taking the piss with their expenses.

We absolutely should not have kept those wasters in jobs just for the sake of it. They had to go.

Having got rid, and having steadied the ship at the same time, we've now got additional investment that's allowing us to put an extensive new system in place. That is a big job that has taken time to plan and is now being put into operation.

This is all positive news.

If you think it should have been there earlier, then complain about it earlier and celebrate that it has now happened. Don't wait until the problem is fixed before complaining that we had a problem.
You clearly still miss my point. As demonstrated by the quoted post.
 

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