Vaux site......



See clueless. You cant compare us to Newcastle at all. Their catchment area is about 4 times the size of ours. It also got city status during the industrial revolution.
Lets face it.You are a loser with an inferuirity complex excuse laden mindset and a sub standard one at that.
But isn’t the issue that Hull whilst a similar size to Sunderland in terms of population doesn’t have any real direct competition to it from neighbouring towns / cities?

Likewise isn’t Nottingham the largest and most prominent city in that area. You could use derby or even Leicester as a comparitor of course as it is a similar proximity from its regional core city.

The council have been wasteful, made mistake and missed opportunities but likewise they have had difficult economic decisions outwith it’s control in some cases which has affected progress.
Excuses excuses and more excuses.
Ljen cant spell either.
And Im still waiting for your realistic proposals.
Ive fully explained myself and realistic proposals but you choose to ignore and mock.
See clueless. You cant compare us to Newcastle at all. Their catchment area is about 4 times the size of ours. It also got city status during the industrial revolution.
😄😄😄More excuses.
 
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Excuses excuses and more excuses.

Ok, clearly there is no reasoning with you and you have completely unrealistic expectations. Comparing us to two (Nottingham and Newcastle) of the uk’s identified 10 core cities is just not a fair comparison.

Out of interest are you involved in property development? Construction industry? Or regeneration?
 
Lets face it.You are a loser with an inferuirity complex excuse laden mindset and a sub standard one at that.

Excuses excuses and more excuses.

Ive fully explained myself and realistic proposals but you choose to ignore and mock.

😄😄😄More excuses.

Stop lying Ljen. You havent given any alternatives at all. Im still waiting. Ive asked about 10 times now & just avoiding the issue cos you cant answer.

And stating Newcastle's catchment area is bigger isnt an excuse. Its a blatant fact. Its actually an excuse on your part for not answering questions

So stop making excuses for Newcastle you gravy stained mag
Ok, clearly there is no reasoning with you and you have completely unrealistic expectations. Comparing us to two (Nottingham and Newcastle) of the uk’s identified 10 core cities is just not a fair comparison.

Out of interest are you involved in property development? Construction industry? Or regeneration?

He runs a chip down Roker after his burger venture failed due to online abuse of customers
 
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Stop lying Ljen. You havent given any alternatives at all. Im still waiting. Ive asked about 10 times now & just avoiding the issue cos you cant answer.

And stating Newcastle's catchment area is bigger isnt an excuse. Its a blatant fact. Its actually an excuse on your part for not answering questions

So stop making excuses for Newcastle you gravy stained mag


He runs a chip down Roker after his burger venture failed due to online abuse of customers

I think you also have to add that Newcastle has been designated the NE regional capital for probably a couple of centuries at least, which has thus seen the lion share of investment up here is also a key point. Whilst we can say what we think about Sunderland as locals to the region etc people outside the region barely know where Sunderland is, and know of Newcastle first and foremost.

There is a lot of talk about our coast and whilst it is beautiful and we are lucky to have it, coastal towns are no longer a sole reason a tourist would choose to visit a place as we don’t have the weather like on the continent therefore the coast becomes an attractive place for people to live and day visit or to stay when travelling to the wider city or region for business or leisure reasons.
 
I think you also have to add that Newcastle has been designated the NE regional capital for probably a couple of centuries at least, which has thus seen the lion share of investment up here is also a key point. Whilst we can say what we think about Sunderland as locals to the region etc people outside the region barely know where Sunderland is, and know of Newcastle first and foremost.

There is a lot of talk about our coast and whilst it is beautiful and we are lucky to have it, coastal towns are no longer a sole reason a tourist would choose to visit a place as we don’t have the weather like on the continent therefore the coast becomes an attractive place for people to live and day visit or to stay when travelling to the wider city or region for business or leisure reasons.

Er no it hasn't.Maybe by those who live there but noi one else. Durham is and always has been capital of the NE if there is such a thing. Newcastle has had more investment than anywhere else since the 60s though and the rest of the region needs to fight back and take theire own slice of any investment pie.
 
Er no it hasn't.Maybe by those who live there but noi one else. Durham is and always has been capital of the NE if there is such a thing. Newcastle has had more investment than anywhere else since the 60s though and the rest of the region needs to fight back and take theire own slice of any investment pie.

Its been the main business district for the past century.
 
Er no it hasn't.Maybe by those who live there but noi one else. Durham is and always has been capital of the NE if there is such a thing. Newcastle has had more investment than anywhere else since the 60s though and the rest of the region needs to fight back and take theire own slice of any investment pie.

I’m sorry but everything I’ve read about the history of the north east points to Newcastle as being the major urban and economic core in north east. I wasn’t around in those days so just what I’ve read.

We did rival Newcastle for a period of time during the era of ship building and mining however even at that time Sunderland was a town whereas Newcastle a city. You can tell by the quality of the buildings and scale of some of their historic investments that it has driven more wealth - just look at the train station, dean st and grey st alone.

Moreover it’s the perception of people outside the region where this counts most.

Is Newcastle the region's capital?

Also I’ve never said that we shouldnt take our Share investment at all, and I agree we need more investment. The main issue is getting the right kind of investment and being realistic in our expectations of what the City should be that is not to say we shouldn’t be ambitious - but sadly we are very unlikely over take Newcastle in terms of economic output - unless the next Facebook, Amazon, google was created and based itself here.
Its been the main business district for the past century.

And even earlier. From what I understand Newcastle was used to controlled the north east coal trade rights since 1600’s.
 
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The best way the region can become overall competitive is if all the different areas become competitive against each other! Let me explain. Where Sunderland has speculated on office space it's now being filled... tax office in now Hays travel, Shackleton house now the medical school, Angel house now apartments, the beam has its first two tenants. Now if Sunderland didn't speculate on these buildings in the past there wouldn't have been the opportunity to attract them in the first place. There is literally no evidence of this mythical 'trickle down' effect from larger urban centre's. Since that report is 13 years old we can see the region as a whole poorer...the "left-behinds". The government policy of centralisation has badly failed peripheral towns and cities. So it's truly a good thing the region can be competitive within. Recent years have seen a shift in policy in Sunderland to develop its own urban core....well done and long may it continue
 
The best way the region can become overall competitive is if all the different areas become competitive against each other! Let me explain. Where Sunderland has speculated on office space it's now being filled... tax office in now Hays travel, Shackleton house now the medical school, Angel house now apartments, the beam has its first two tenants. Now if Sunderland didn't speculate on these buildings in the past there wouldn't have been the opportunity to attract them in the first place. There is literally no evidence of this mythical 'trickle down' effect from larger urban centre's. Since that report is 13 years old we can see the region as a whole poorer...the "left-behinds". The government policy of centralisation has badly failed peripheral towns and cities. So it's truly a good thing the region can be competitive within. Recent years have seen a shift in policy in Sunderland to develop its own urban core....well done and long may it continue

My counter to that is if Newcastle is successful then demand and rental prices increase, this then means Sunderland becomes more attractive from a business perspective as a business could save 10’s or 100’s of thousands of pounds per year and over a course of a lease term (5-15 years) becomes a considerable sum. If Sunderland was competitive with Newcastle and say at the same rental tone as Newcastle then a business is most likely to locate themselves in Newcastle from both a minimum a recruitment and transport link perceptive.

If all towns or cities in the region become popular then it means that we can compete on a regional level with other areas such as Leeds and Manchester. Even Newcastle is quite a bit behind these cities.
 
Er no it hasn't.Maybe by those who live there but noi one else. Durham is and always has been capital of the NE if there is such a thing. Newcastle has had more investment than anywhere else since the 60s though and the rest of the region needs to fight back and take theire own slice of any investment pie.

I really do hate to disagree with you as I regard Sunderland being in County Durham as opposed to the now defunct Tyne & Wear.

Newcastle is classed as a hub and therefore receives more funding.

I was once told that even though Sunderland had a greater population (at the time) that policing wise it received less cash (even though it was all in the same force). Sunderlands funding was on par with Wallsend
 
My counter to that is if Newcastle is successful then demand and rental prices increase, this then means Sunderland becomes more attractive from a business perspective as a business could save 10’s or 100’s of thousands of pounds per year and over a course of a lease term (5-15 years) becomes a considerable sum. If Sunderland was competitive with Newcastle and say at the same rental tone as Newcastle then a business is most likely to locate themselves in Newcastle from both a minimum a recruitment and transport link perceptive.

If all towns or cities in the region become popular then it means that we can compete on a regional level with other areas such as Leeds and Manchester. Even Newcastle is quite a bit behind these cities.
Yes but there's no evidence if a larger urban centre does well it trickles down to the peripheral areas. If it did the likes of bolton, blackburn and Burnley would prosper on the back of Manchester......it hasn't happened and they've struggled. Just as Bradford has struggled next to Leeds. Also there's no evidence if these peripheral towns compete with urban centres it's got a detrimental effect on the latter. Rather it's beneficial as commutes are smaller....as people work closer to home.
 
Yes but there's no evidence if a larger urban centre does well it trickles down to the peripheral areas. If it did the likes of bolton, blackburn and Burnley would prosper on the back of Manchester......it hasn't happened and they've struggled. Just as Bradford has struggled next to Leeds. Also there's no evidence if these peripheral towns compete with urban centres it's got a detrimental effect on the latter. Rather it's beneficial as commutes are smaller....as people work closer to home.

I don’t disagree and I guess that’s my point Sunderland needs to differentiate itself to some degree from Newcastle rather than purely compete.

It needs to become a sustainable city with its employment focussed in the city centre were possible and probably to look at new and progressive manufacturing. More over to be competitive it needs to invest in people and it’s education system to make business want to relocate next to a qualified labour market where possible. Sadly as we don’t have a university of Durham or Newcastle university standing (Russell university) this will provide difficult so we need to churn out good secondary and college qualified students to move into roles.

Beyond that it needs to become the place of choice to live in the region with good quality housing, which in turn should hopefully impact on the quality and viability of the city centre.
 
My counter to that is if Newcastle is successful then demand and rental prices increase, this then means Sunderland becomes more attractive from a business perspective as a business could save 10’s or 100’s of thousands of pounds per year and over a course of a lease term (5-15 years) becomes a considerable sum. If Sunderland was competitive with Newcastle and say at the same rental tone as Newcastle then a business is most likely to locate themselves in Newcastle from both a minimum a recruitment and transport link perceptive.

If all towns or cities in the region become popular then it means that we can compete on a regional level with other areas such as Leeds and Manchester. Even Newcastle is quite a bit behind these cities.

I think the problem with this argument is that whilst Sunderland may get a bit better, the gulf between the 2 cities becomes even greater. This means that youll just get even more moaning like jealous neighbours.
 
I don’t disagree and I guess that’s my point Sunderland needs to differentiate itself to some degree from Newcastle rather than purely compete.

It needs to become a sustainable city with its employment focussed in the city centre were possible and probably to look at new and progressive manufacturing. More over to be competitive it needs to invest in people and it’s education system to make business want to relocate next to a qualified labour market where possible. Sadly as we don’t have a university of Durham or Newcastle university standing (Russell university) this will provide difficult so we need to churn out good secondary and college qualified students to move into roles.

Beyond that it needs to become the place of choice to live in the region with good quality housing, which in turn should hopefully impact on the quality and viability of the city centre.

As much as it can try to differentiate we would still be completing for office based jobs....hays travel, tombolo, Ocado, Penshaw view training......these could all be based in Newcastle if office accommodation hadn't been speculated on. The kick back is city centre traders get a boost from these companies being located there and also business rates. Now had we taken the view that office based jobs in Sunderland city centre "wasn't our thing". We would expect them to locate elsewhere...so this is the very reason the region needs to overlap on sectors not traditionally their own
 
As much as it can try to differentiate we would still be completing for office based jobs....hays travel, tombolo, Ocado, Penshaw view training......these could all be based in Newcastle if office accommodation hadn't been speculated on. The kick back is city centre traders get a boost from these companies being located there and also business rates. Now had we taken the view that office based jobs in Sunderland city centre "wasn't our thing". We would expect them to locate elsewhere...so this is the very reason the region needs to overlap on sectors not traditionally their own

Sorry apologies if I’m not coming across clear. I think it’s fundamental that we develop the Vaux site and possibly a little more with modern grade a office accommodation. This will most certainly require speculative office development albeit this will come at a cost in terms of potentially susidising some office development until rental levels become viable. More office Accommodation (more people employed in the city centre) will drive a better retail and leisure offer as will more and better housing in the city, particularly the city centre.

What I am also however saying is that it is unrealistic to think Sunderland will ever be at the scale and size of say Newcastle both in terms of office and retail scale, nor is it likely that we’ll have as many people visiting the city from a tourist perspective.
I think the problem with this argument is that whilst Sunderland may get a bit better, the gulf between the 2 cities becomes even greater. This means that youll just get even more moaning like jealous neighbours.

I think to some degree that is inevitable with Newcastle becoming the major commercial centre and Sunderland being secondary.
 
What I am also however saying is that it is unrealistic to think Sunderland will ever be at the scale and size of say Newcastle both in terms of office and retail scale, nor is it likely that we’ll have as many people visiting the city from a tourist perspective.
I'm not at all suggesting it is....but what I am suggesting is Sunderland starts to make its centre more competitive, more commercial, more diverse and competes for white collar office workers. No matter how futile people thinks it is, but the perception of Sunderland as a post industrial town is changing. It's becoming a modern centre for commerce. And it would be a dereliction of duty on the part of the council and development corporations if they didn't at least try and compete...
 
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