If you have kids of school age

I absolutely can - does it warrant a £75k salary?


The discipline needs to be sensible, our lads school is wound far too tight, especially on uniform. Tie done up tight, dress shoes and dark coats, it's just not practical when they play footy at breaktime, nor safe when they walk home in the dark nights, nor conducive to good learning as it's very uncomfortable. The school say it's preparing them for work but if they take a moment to check most businesses are moving the other way and there are lots of places where everyone dresses casually everyday. Rules for rules sake doesn't wash anymore.


Academies set their own salaries, that is open to abuse.


I'd love to know where all the Billions of tax is going, it's not on welfare. My guess is propping up pensions for those who paid in £1.87 and now want 50% of their final salary.


I agree, it's need completely modernising.

I can't believe the every teacher has to create every lesson plan from scratch and that their isn't a better way to share collateral.

Same for marking, the days of the pile of paper books and red pens is surely ripe for something better.

AI based interactive learning systems for each child is the way forward.


Aye the days when I was at school and got beaten black and blue are just what we need eh? State-wide child abuse is not an answer.

Completely disagree
School should prepare children for adult life.
My wife has a business and employs apprentices however most have no idea about respect, application of rules or how to assertively engage.
I’m glad your kids school has tight boundaries. This is what school should be. Not concentration camps but leaders of respect and implemtation of boundaries.
I just hope you don’t opnely critisice this.
I’m sure that as a respectful parent, any grievances you have will be brought to the attention of the head rather than siding with the children or waging war on social media as I have witnessed before.
 


To answer where you qutoed me - a large proportion does go on welfare. Also pensions and NHS are biggies. You get an annual statement telling you what tax is spent on. From memory about 38% is spent on welfare, but I could be wrong as doing that from memory.
Pensions is the biggest part of welfare, now I've no issue with making sure pensioners are looked after but I know a lot of pensioners who are very wealthy and still getting way more than they need from the state. This money should be spent elsewhere.

Completely disagree
School should prepare children for adult life.
My wife has a business and employs apprentices however most have no idea about respect, application of rules or how to assertively engage.
I’m glad your kids school has tight boundaries. This is what school should be. Not concentration camps but leaders of respect and implemtation of boundaries.
I just hope you don’t opnely critisice this.
I’m sure that as a respectful parent, any grievances you have will be brought to the attention of the head rather than siding with the children or waging war on social media as I have witnessed before.
When the school implements the rules well, they have my support, when they don't they do not. Never by social media but by explaining to the kids how to courteously question bad decisions. Some teachers deal with this well, others just want total obedience and not to be questioned, however Queen Victoria is not on the throne any more.

Tight boundaries is completely wrong, we're driving the creative side out kids. The economy no longer needs drones to complete repetitive tasks, it needs kids who can think and challenge, not blindly follow rules. School should be enjoyable not just endured.

As I always said to my teachers, you earn respect it works both ways. Haranguing kids because their top button is undone in the height of summer serves no purpose and destroys respect.
 
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To put all of this into context. A school report of my big sister


Maybe you should have studied economics. The country has been running a deficitc year on year meaning the national debt has continued to rise. I won't labour the point suffice to say that you can't continue to spend what you don't have.

It wouldnt have been running a deficit if the govt hadnt choked off the recovery. But lets be honest here, in the budget they just spent another £1 billion on weapons, we can always afford wars, we can always afford huge pay increases for MPs, we can always afford a couple of billion to buy the DUPs support to prop up the failing PM, we can afford to spend 7 billion on the houses of parliament refurb but leave kids sitting in classrooms full of holes in the roof and in building riddled with asbestos, but we can afford the £400 million refurb of Buckingham palace even though the Queen has already had the money once from the tax payer but failed to spend it on maintaining her properties. We can afford millions of £ to police minor royals weddings, we could afford millions to run a completely unnecessary general election as the PM thought she could build a bigger majority (then lost so had to spend billions buying off the DUP)..........I could go on.......There is nothing more important than education, it is the foundation of all industries and all sectors....Poor education leads to a failing country, end of story.

So apart from spending more money you have got no more ideas.

You need the money to fund the ideas....There are scores of things that could be done, sadly when you dont fund them they cant be done.

Huge issues in school with mental health problems, schools dont have the money to fund counsellings services to deal with it and CAMHS has just been overwhelmed as it has had its funding cut to the bone....Stupid thing is those kids if dealt with as teens would go on to be productive tax payers but no, save a few ££ and they end up on the scrap heap as adults.

SEN kids need support and it is being slashed to the point that often there is none, without money it cant be dealt with as nobody works for free.

Kids with severe behavioural issues (including extreme violence) can no longer be found places in alternative provisions like Pupil referral units as those units are all rammed full.....Also when each pupil is allocated £5k per year funding at a school then a PRU place costing £30k a year or more is massively undaffordable as budgets are squeezed to breaking.

School buildings are literally falling apart with water pouring through the roofs, huge gaps round window frames, asbestos in situ in huge quantities and heating the often breaks down more than it works. It cannot be fixed without money. (And thats some of the new builds *barring the asbestos issue)

A teaching workforce is becoming less and less experienced as those with experience would rather take huge pay cuts to work in other jobs than stay and have their health both mental and physical ruined by the obscene work load and trying to cope with behaviour that is getting worse and worse due to mental health issues and behavioural issues no longer adequately being dealth with due to cuts (see above)......I know teachers with 20 years experience who have taken pay cuts from £38k a year salaries to earn around half of that working in call centres rather than try to continue in education under these circumstances.

So to answer your question no, without the money being made available there is not much else can be done as anything and everything that can be done "free" (usually meaning staff working even more unpaid hours) has already been done.

I agree with much of what you say but its not as simple as to say they are under funded. Firstly I would say the school's I know about (my wife's school, my kids school, another school I am involved with) are better than they ever have been in terms of the education the kids get. Funding is becoming a real issue but hasn't bitten yet as you describe. One of the big problem is that all schools get different amounts per pupil. One school in the borough that my kids have gone to get more than £1k per pupil more than my kids school. Also, the average the Newcastle school's get per pupil is higher than the average that South Tyneside school's get which, in turn, is higher than the average that Sunderland schools get. So, if your kids go to a Newcastle school the funding is not nearly such a problem. Interesting that the school that is shutting in South Tyneside due to its failure, South Shields School gets the most funding and is not an Academy.

Additionally despite the poor funding the education the kids are getting is better with each year - the measures of Maths and English are getting better and better. The education my kids have received is light years ahead of what I got in the '70's and '80's. That said, my view, as a school governor, is that the funding problem in schools could be about to blow. So, I disagree with the doom and gloom you describe because my experience is that that is not the reality. However, unless addressed I think the scenarios you describe could develop if the funding problem is not addressed.

Problem is that this is being done by exploiting and burning out staff....What is the plan now staff are just leaving in their thousands and they are struggling to recruit more? How will it work when class sizes continue to rise and rise which will push more staff to leave as the workload becomes more unmanageable.

Im sorry, while it may not be the experience at your school I can categorically tell you that it is the experience in many. The education provided by teachers is excellent but if you have huge issues with kids with mental health issues that are not being treated etc then all the great teaching in the world will be for nothing as the kids will not access it or often will not end up taking the exams to prove they have had this great teaching.

For what its worth I think governors are often the last people to understand the reality of what its like in the school they govern. Schools managements has a vested interested in making sure the governors get a positive view of the school as to not reflects on them. A bit like when OFSTED are kicking about Governors often see a very different school than the one that functions day to day.

My son is in the "upper set" at monky house ,the school i was in 30 plus years ago and i've been imporessed with both the teachers and the pupils.According to popular myths schools are full of unruly kids and hopeless teachers

Agree with this, lots of great kids and great practice. Sadly it is despite the govt, the Dfed, OFSTED.....The damage they have done to education and to teaching is beyond belief and it is a credit to amazing staff like those that you have mentioned that they continue to deliver results while having an anchor tied round their necks.

It needs a different approach, having an adult stand in front of 30 kids is not going to work forever. I know kids are different but at work we rarely send people on classroom training courses anymore, the online stuff is just too good. If we could get online stuff designed specifically for kids that adapts to each child and has a massive catalogue of lessons it could be used nationally, leaving the teachers to help with what isn't included instead of re-inventing the wheel every week.

Very little teaching (good teaching anyway) works like this anymore.

As mq10 said last night it was just shite bait from me, but i still stand by what i say about mixed ability/attitude classes. Sorry but there are some kids who don`t want to learn more classical subjects - english maths etc, some that do and some that could if no distractions and i think the idea of a one size fits all approach lets everyone down badly. Me mam was a teacher and despite all the jokes about long holidays etc i`ve seen exactly what goes into it offstage as it were, trying to plan lessons round curriculums that will try and include everyone and all abilities and it`s a losing battle from the off

Very few classes are mixed ability with zero core subjects like Maths/English/Science not being setted. Only time there is mixed ability is GCSE where a subject only has a small number of kids opt for it and its not cost effective to set/stream

Certainly is a large part of the problem, seen/heard some stupid stuff over the past couple of years on the school run. Heard some whinging because the school sent a letter reminding parents to read with the child and sign in a book to confirm. As valuable as a school is to a childs development, disinterested parenting is going to hold it back significantly imo.

100% this, where kids have parental support 99% will do very well. The link between parenting and achievement is undoubtedly closer than achievement and the standard of teaching.
 
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Good points, but I'm not seeing anywhere near enough of what is possible. There are pockets and it is changing, but it does need to change further to remove the repetitive work from teachers so they can teach.

This is that different approach. Especially if the online learning can adapt beyond just videos and tailor itself for childrens abilities.

Software like Google classrooms has revolutionised classrooms. A hugely powerful tool and free......A video resource/documentary of say 30 mins that would have traditionally have been watched in class is now set for homework and watched on their phones via google classrooms so that 30 mins work is done before they arrive in class and the teachers can teach rather than sit and watch the video with the kids as happened in the past.......Often kids will watch this on their way home from school on the bus.........Pupils also able to contact teachers directly via systems like this to clarify homework etc. Brilliant tool and while no fan of google they are delivering for education big time.

Pensions is the biggest part of welfare, now I've no issue with making sure pensioners are looked after but I know a lot of pensioners who are very wealthy and still getting way more than they need from the state. This money should be spent elsewhere.


When the school implements the rules well, they have my support, when they don't they do not. Never by social media but by explaining to the kids how to courteously question bad decisions. Some teachers deal with this well, others just want total obedience and not to be questioned, however Queen Victoria is not on the throne any more.

Tight boundaries is completely wrong, we're driving the creative side out kids. The economy no longer needs drones to complete repetitive tasks, it needs kids who can think and challenge, not blindly follow rules. School should be enjoyable not just endured.


As I always said to my teachers, you earn respect it works both ways. Haranguing kids because their top button is undone in the height of summer serves no purpose and destroys respect.

This is what schools were like pre Michael Gove, sadly he decided schools should all be run like the "Golden age" he sat through so he reverted the curriculum, assessment and exam styles to the 1960s/70s........Why on earth are kids memorising 30 or 40 shakespeare quotes for an English exam in the 21st century, its beyond absurd. That is not education, its a memory test, a party trick that has no real world application.
 
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Software like Google classrooms has revolutionised classrooms. A hugely powerful tool and free......A video resource/documentary of say 30 mins that would have traditionally have been watched in class is now set for homework and watched on their phones via google classrooms so that 30 mins work is done before they arrive in class and the teachers can teach rather than sit and watch the video with the kids as happened in the past.......Often kids will watch this on their way home from school on the bus.........Pupils also able to contact teachers directly via systems like this to clarify homework etc. Brilliant tool and while no fan of google they are delivering for education big time.



This is what schools were like pre Michael Gove, sadly he decided schools should all be run like the "Golden age" he sat through so he reverted the curriculum, assessment and exam styles to the 1960s/70s........Why on earth are kids memorising 30 or 40 shakespeare quotes for an English exam in the 21st century, its beyond absurd. That is not education, its a memory test, a party trick that has no real world application.

The little uns school are using an app called Class Dojo, kind of a messageboard for back and forth between parents/teachers. No more missing letters in the bottom of bags. It's infuriating though as apparently she is consistantly well behaved at school yet is a little shite for me. Felt bad for them when she brought a reading book home that was from a school that shut down in 2003. Have started giving them ours when she grows out of them.
 
Incorrect - Academies are 'not for profit' by law. They do not have shareholders. The main difference is that they do their own accounts whereas LA schools have their accounts done by the local authority. There really is a lot of rubbish talked about academies. The lack of funding affects academies and LA schools equally.


Exactly the same with me - the standard of education my kids have got has been outstanding and I believe the same where my wife teaches. When I went to school I was let down by education, it was utter rubbish. This rarely happens now. Obviously documentary makers can find schools to fit any argument but generally state education has improved massively, even in the last 10 years - hence the reason why private schools are shutting down - why pay when you can get great education for free.
So the money that the academy says it’s spent on infrastructure but gets proven not to have spent it, where’s that been squirrelled away too?
 
So the money that the academy says it’s spent on infrastructure but gets proven not to have spent it, where’s that been squirrelled away too?
You tell me - there is fraud in local authorities you know? You said that an Academy has gone back into local authority because it was making insufficient profits - that is incorrect as they, by law, don't make profit.
 
Snowflake teachers with no idea how to instill or maintain discipline in the little cherubs doesnt help one iota
Maybe if teachers were treated more fairly and valued like other professions and rewarded accordingly we`d get a higher calibre of teacher to teach our kids. Cut corners, treat them with contempt and you end up in the mess we`re currently in.
 
I can tell you that it is a lack of money causing problems in school.....Kids with mental health issues no longer able to access CAMHS, alternative provisions for kids with severe behavioural issues all but gone due to cost, learning support assistants for kids with SEN disappearing, experienced staff disappearing in their thousands and replaced by cheaper newly qualified staff without the experience to cope in schools. Class sizes rising as teachers quit and they cant afford to recruit replacements even when they are needed, thousands of teachers leaving to work in supply as the work load is normal rather than mental, thousands of teachers being expected to teach subjects they have no experience in...

Ultimately, its the kids that suffer so while you might not think its the issue it clearly is and if you have kids in school then you need to be calling the govt out on it as the system is falling apart.

Watch the programme, when the teachers pay is slashed by up to £6k a year they werent complaining about their own situation they were worried about the impact on the kids they teach.

Yet none of that support existed when I was a child. Why is it needed now?
 

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