East Coast line to be taken back into public ownership again

He might know someone who does and, you know, talk with them


I thought ending a sentence with a question mark usually indicated that you were not sure of something and were asking a question.
I don’t know the answer...hence the question mark?

If he knows someone in the industry he’s showing no sign of it

Looking after the railway

So which operators do maintain track infrastructure?

Evolution of rail franchising forms part of UK government’s new ‘strategic vision for rail’
 


The rewards system was class when it was the east coast mainline, hopefully that returns. Load of shite getting nectar points when it was virgin.
 
If you haven't fucked up on your numbers, why would you hand it back?
Maybe they have and they’ve paid the price

Sorry for my ignorance but it doesn't mention a single TOC that maintains it's own lines, overheads, signalling etc.

It's a lovely vision though
It’s says that it happened so more than a vision. So yes....every operator spends a lot of money on infrastructure.

You learned something today
 
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Maybe they have and they’ve paid the price


It’s says that it happened so more than a vision. So yes....every operator spends a lot of money on infrastructure.

You learned something today

Apart from this statement:

Building on Network Rail’s recent devolution of infrastructure management to route-based businesses, the plans include complementary changes to the franchising system to ensure that the railway is prepared to manage the challenges of the future, while maintaining the railway infrastructure in public ownership.

It appears you have no understanding of Network Rail devolution plan either.

What they did was go from an autocratic national setup to a more autonamous regional set up to allow for greater flexibility to respond to local demands and pressures as part of public/private partnerships whilst the control of it is still 100% with Network Rail.

Now you could compare this to the NHS. Private companies operate within in it but it is still under public control. Have a look at the https://assets.publishing.service.g...tachment_data/file/663124/rail-vision-web.pdf. Its quite enlightening

A bit of a generalisation here like. What about all the successful franchises? Arriva (a successful Sunderland company) are successfully operating Northern, Chiltern, Cross Country, Wales, London and Grand Central, as well as Services in 13 other countries.

DfT rules require that they make investments in infrastructure so the government doesn’t have to.


More experts could be renationalised after East Coast fiasco | Daily Mail Online

Seems you were a bit premature in your lauding of Arriva (your company) as they appear to be not doing very well on the Northern franchise.......
 
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Apart from this statement:

Building on Network Rail’s recent devolution of infrastructure management to route-based businesses, the plans include complementary changes to the franchising system to ensure that the railway is prepared to manage the challenges of the future, while maintaining the railway infrastructure in public ownership.

It appears you have no understanding of Network Rail devolution plan either.

What they did was go from an autocratic national setup to a more autonamous regional set up to allow for greater flexibility to respond to local demands and pressures as part of public/private partnerships whilst the control of it is still 100% with Network Rail.

Now you could compare this to the NHS. Private companies operate within in it but it is still under public control. Have a look at the https://assets.publishing.service.g...tachment_data/file/663124/rail-vision-web.pdf. Its quite enlightening




More experts could be renationalised after East Coast fiasco | Daily Mail Online

Seems you were a bit premature in your lauding of Arriva (your company) as they appear to be not doing very well on the Northern franchise.......

Arriva are doing very well on the Northern franchise and there's no substance in the suggestion that the government could take it back. Is this where you take your knowledge from...the Daily Mail :lol:

Also, good job on ignoring the bit about devolution of infrastructure management.
 
Arriva are doing very well on the Northern franchise and there's no substance in the suggestion that the government could take it back. Is this where you take your knowledge from...the Daily Mail :lol:

Also, good job on ignoring the bit about devolution of infrastructure management.
No its actually the Times if you read it properly i just gave you that for the beneift of not having to subscribe to the Times.

it seems you cant read. I have posted and you have quoted about the devolution. Do they not give the plan to the ticket inspectors anymore? I even posted a link for the actual document, not a post from an inductry magazine.
 
No its actually the Times if you read it properly i just gave you that for the beneift of not having to subscribe to the Times.

it seems you cant read. I have posted and you have quoted about the devolution. Do they not give the plan to the ticket inspectors anymore? I even posted a link for the actual document, not a post from an inductry magazine.

Who knows the industry the best...the Mail, the times, Andy Burnham or people in the industry? Let me put it in order for you...Industry, Andy Burnham, Times, Mail, you.

What you don't get here is that most of this stuff remains in public ownership, even though the operators invest hugely in it. When a franchise ends they have to completely hand over an operating company, staff, equipment, hardware, software, etc, etc. They don't own the trains...they can't even sign key contracts without getting approval from the DfT. Even so, the operators invest in infrastructure of their own and infrastructure that they own or manage temporarily. This is why it's virtually impossible for a small player to take on a franchise.

The vast majority of the staff working for stagecoach and virgin would have previously worked for National Express and they will work for the government tomorrow (or possibly Arup who seem to be stepping in to do interim work for the government). Virtually none of them would have considered themselves Virgin or Stagecoach employees...they would have considered themselves as East Coat Railway staff.

Thats why i put allegedly given your inferences to suggest you know everything about it

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Not everything...just more than you, which isn't difficult
 
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Who knows the industry the best...the Mail, the times, Andy Burnham or people in the industry? Let me put it in order for you...Industry, Andy Burnham, Times, Mail, you.

What you don't get here is that most of this stuff remains in public ownership, even though the operators invest hugely in it. When a franchise ends they have to completely hand over an operating company, staff, equipment, hardware, software, etc, etc. They don't own the trains...they can't even sign key contracts without getting approval from the DfT. Even so, the operators invest in infrastructure of their own and infrastructure that they own or manage temporarily. This is why it's virtually impossible for a small player to take on a franchise.

The vast majority of the staff working for stagecoach and northern would have previously worked for National Express and they will work for the government tomorrow (or possibly Arup who seem to be stepping in to do interim work for the government). Virtually none of them would have considered themselves Virgin or Stagecoach employees...they would have considered themselves as East Coat Railway staff.


Not everything...just more than you, which isn't difficult

You are completely ignoring the fact i am not making any reference to the TOCs and what they do with franchises. I have consistently maintained the fact that under the auspices of Network Rail track and track side stuff is done by them or their subcontracted partners eg Story, Amey etc. This has nothing to do with who bought the uniforms of the train driver, who looks after the Wifi. You keep bringing this up and it is of no interest to me or relevant to the initial point i made regarding the important infrastructure of bits of metal that trains run on.

I have asked continually which TOC actually provides trackside maintenance to repair junctions, signals etc and you keep bouncing it back to the information boards every time. I couldnt give a shit who does that, but interestingly nothing changes when a franchise ends apart from the corporate stuff.

So apart from the alliance working of the TOCs and Network Rail such as the shared control centres and morning meetings following the 2016/17 devolution it appears your only knowledge of the train industry is restricted to what happens in a station, hence my picture of Harry Enfield.

Unless of course you can come back and say you work as employee of a rail company in a strategic role????

Ps the article in the Times (quoted in the Mail) was by Adrian Quine who is a Railway Analyst. I suspect he knows a little bit more than most
 
You are completely ignoring the fact i am not making any reference to the TOCs and what they do with franchises. I have consistently maintained the fact that under the auspices of Network Rail track and track side stuff is done by them or their subcontracted partners eg Story, Amey etc. This has nothing to do with who bought the uniforms of the train driver, who looks after the Wifi. You keep bringing this up and it is of no interest to me or relevant to the initial point i made regarding the important infrastructure of bits of metal that trains run on.

I have asked continually which TOC actually provides trackside maintenance to repair junctions, signals etc and you keep bouncing it back to the information boards every time. I couldnt give a shit who does that, but interestingly nothing changes when a franchise ends apart from the corporate stuff.

So apart from the alliance working of the TOCs and Network Rail such as the shared control centres and morning meetings following the 2016/17 devolution it appears your only knowledge of the train industry is restricted to what happens in a station, hence my picture of Harry Enfield.

Unless of course you can come back and say you work as employee of a rail company in a strategic role????

I said:
DfT rules require that they make investments in infrastructure so the government doesn’t have to.

You said:
Network Rail manage infrastructure. They are a public body

I said:
Franchise operators manage infrastructure too

You said:
Apparently private operators run their own infrastructure (with the exception of stations). This is not the case. There is a fact. Care to rebut it?


So your 'fact' is wrong :lol::lol:
 

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