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Defoe

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MackemX said:
Hoy me on ignore now :lol:

You do realise I was just fantasising about that 10 goals in 15 games when I said "he may well bang them in" and who is to say it won't happen when I gave an example of how it could happen? Chances are it won't and I certainly wouldn't put money on it :lol:. I have even said that his 1 in 3 stat should set him a target of 6 goals but is that enough goals to win the points?

http://www.readytogo.net/smb/thread...-plenty-after-32.1021802/page-2#post-19512711



Goals per season isn't the only relevant stat because when Defoe isn't on the pitch then aren't there surely going to be times when another striker will be playing instead so therefore they could score also? If all your strikers have low mins per goal then that's what you want isn't it?

Lets say 2 teams play with a lone striker the whole season and there are 3 players of equal fitness/stamina. Team 1 has just player A but Team 2 have player B and C to share the lone striker role.

Team 1: The lone striker is player A who plays every minute of all 38 games. He scores 13 goals in the season so gets a 2.92 average appearances per goal.
Team 2: The lone striker role is shared between players B and C. Player B starts the game and gets subbed after 60 mins every game but only scores 10 goals in the season so ends up with a 3.8 average appearances per goal. That leaves 30 mins for another striker (player C) to come and have a bash so let's say he gets a goal just over every 6 appearances. That would give him 6 goals for the season with 6.3 appearance per goal.

Which team will end up with the most goals from the lone striker's position? Pretty obvious answer isn't it and that's why I think goals per season is not the only really relevant stat at all and if anything a less meaningful stat that appearances per goal. Aye player A scored the most but overall he's taken the whole season's minutes to get those goals. Yet player B and player C who have less goals per season and also a poorer goals per appearance ratio. Based on your comment of goals per season is the only relevant stat then player A is the best when it's actually the reverse. He's the top scorer out of the 3 but that's about it regarding positives but is this the only relevant stat?

Which player do you think has the best mins per goal?
Player A gets a goal every 263 mins yet Player B gets a goal every 228 mins and Player C gets a goal every 190 mins! Scale them up and player B should get 15 goals if he was lone striker all season but still got the same mins per goal stat. Player C could get 18 which is actually better than the 13 goals from player A. Remember I said equal fitness/stamina so players B and C could last 90 mins but they have to share the role for Team 2.

An example of misleading goals in a season/appearances per goal being Fletcher in 2012-13 season as mentioned above. Aye it's class he got 11 goals but he needed 85 mins per appearance to get them. What you are saying is that if Defoe scored just 10 goals with 62 mins per appearance then this isn't as good. Yet if Defoe did play an average of 85 mins per appearance and maintained his average of a goal every 182 mins then he'd score 15 goals.

Many will also simply remember the basic stat that Altidore got 1 goal in 42 appearances and disregard the fact he only played an average of 50 mins per appearance. It's f***ing shit no matter how you look at it but not as shit. Same goes for Wickham as he's only on 56 mins per appearance whereas Fletcher is on 75 mins per appearance for SAFC so Fletcher has had 20 mins more per appearance yet some will still compare them on goals per appearance ;).

Defoe has got his all his League goals with an average appearance of just 62 mins so that theoretically leaves 28 minutes for another striker to score more goals to add to the tally of goals contributed from that number 10 shirt. If we could hoy Chicharito on for those last 28 mins and maybe now you can see my point about the minutes per goal being the most important stat of all.

Now go back to Bent, I didn't know he averaged about 88 minutes per appearance for his 58 league games! He scored 32 goals and got a goal every 161 minutes but isn't being on the pitch the whole game going to mean more chances to score? Did we have a better team overall back them creating more chances per game than we do now? Even so Defoe isn't that far behind and that's in many subbed games which IMO means he may have missed out on the extra chances that fell to whoever was in his place. Defoe only scored 10 goals in 2001-02 but strangely enough he averaged a goal every 161 mins also as he was only on the pitch 46 mins for his 35 appearances.

So the big question is, how much time will Defoe get on the pitch for the rest of the season? If he somehow spends an average of 85 mins like Fletcher did in his 1st season here then surely due to Defoe's past record of mins per goal, he'll hopefully give a higher goal return than he would if he only average 62 mins per appearance? Whatever it is, I certainly won't be judging him simply on how many goals he scores this season, or even how many goals he scores in X amount of appearances but simply how many pitch minutes it takes him to score a goal on average.

Some canny players stats here for those who look a little past the goals per season/appearances per goal stats.

Wickham
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Fletcher
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Altidore
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Defoe
Bent

p.s. ignore the post as I'm just waffling on anyway seeing as I love stats and @Statto Junkie is just an imposter :lol:
Click to expand...
Somebody needs a life
 
"Jermain Defoe was house-hunting on Wednesday, as his £14million move to Sunderland edged closer.
Defoe flew to the north east with mum Sandra and his advisors for talks."

:eek::oops::lol:
 
Mackemcolin said:
Got be a more orthodox 442 to get the best out of him IMO.

Pants
Jones - Brown - O'Shea - PVA
Johnson - Rodwell/Larsson - Catts - Alvarez?
Fletch - Defoe
Click to expand...

The trouble is that side would be outnumbered in midfield every week because hardly anybody else plays 4-4-2. Those that do are at the bottom of the table. And with Johnson on one wing and Alvarez on another you're really talking 4-2-4.

We can't leave Defoe isolated in the way that Fletcher has been. But we can't afford to go 4-4-2 / 4-2-4 either IMO. Defoe needs to get his support from Johnson cutting in one from one wing, probably from Wickham coming in from the left to provide some strength and power, and from a better attacking midfielder than Gomez behind him (ie Alvarez / Giaccherini). I don't really care whether that is called 4-2-3-1, 4-3-3 or whatever, that's not the point.

Fletcher looks very much like the odd man out to me now.
 
Laidback Jack said:
Sorry @Bop

My cynical self led me to believe you were bullshitting and thus I gave you a bit of stick.

I said I would apologise if you were right- here you go.

Maybe listen to people a bit more next time ;)
Click to expand...

I never said the lad was bullshiting, just that wages would be a problem, but with no transfer fee, i take its easier to offer players close to what they want ?

Now we are just waiting for Jozy to pass his medical and sign on the dotted line, dont let us down son :lol:
 
Twisted said:
I wouldn't be at all surprised if we play like this, not just because poyet is bullish about his system [bar that farcical 5-2-3 or whatever it was for two games]

Our best spell in the premiership since quillips was with darren bent on his own up top, who in all the same ways as defoe can't play on his own up top.

if we have giaccherini behind him playing through balls for defoe to run onto then we can play to his strengths whilst still having the numbers in midfield to keep possesion and press hard [with a bit of effort]

pants

jones o'shea brown pva

cattermole seb​

​

johnson giaccherini alvarez​

​

defoe
​
we even have options with the likes of reveillere, bricutt, rodwell, wickham, fletcher on the bench
Click to expand...

That would be the most lightweight side in the Premier League. Catts 5'10, Larsson 5'10, Johnson 5'9, Giaccherini 5'4, Defoe 5'7. It might well be the best 6 midfielders and attackers we have, but it's certainly not the best balance.
 
Lanchesterredandwhite said:
That would be the most lightweight side in the Premier League. Catts 5'10, Larsson 5'10, Johnson 5'9, Giaccherini 5'4, Defoe 5'7. It might well be the best 6 midfielders and attackers we have, but it's certainly not the best balance.
Click to expand...

shouldn't make too much difference if we are keeping the ball and playing on the deck. ideally rodwell would be in there but he has been so out of form. wickham would be an option to give us something else but generally all of our players are piss weak, who could we bring in? bridcutt is equally a midget, buckley,....?
 
MackemX said:
Hoy me on ignore now :lol:

You do realise I was just fantasising about that 10 goals in 15 games when I said "he may well bang them in" and who is to say it won't happen when I gave an example of how it could happen? Chances are it won't and I certainly wouldn't put money on it :lol:. I have even said that his 1 in 3 stat should set him a target of 6 goals but is that enough goals to win the points?

http://www.readytogo.net/smb/thread...-plenty-after-32.1021802/page-2#post-19512711



Goals per season isn't the only relevant stat because when Defoe isn't on the pitch then aren't there surely going to be times when another striker will be playing instead so therefore they could score also? If all your strikers have low mins per goal then that's what you want isn't it?

Lets say 2 teams play with a lone striker the whole season and there are 3 players of equal fitness/stamina. Team 1 has just player A but Team 2 have player B and C to share the lone striker role.

Team 1: The lone striker is player A who plays every minute of all 38 games. He scores 13 goals in the season so gets a 2.92 average appearances per goal.
Team 2: The lone striker role is shared between players B and C. Player B starts the game and gets subbed after 60 mins every game but only scores 10 goals in the season so ends up with a 3.8 average appearances per goal. That leaves 30 mins for another striker (player C) to come and have a bash so let's say he gets a goal just over every 6 appearances. That would give him 6 goals for the season with 6.3 appearance per goal.

Which team will end up with the most goals from the lone striker's position? Pretty obvious answer isn't it and that's why I think goals per season is not the only really relevant stat at all and if anything a less meaningful stat that appearances per goal. Aye player A scored the most but overall he's taken the whole season's minutes to get those goals. Yet player B and player C who have less goals per season and also a poorer goals per appearance ratio. Based on your comment of goals per season is the only relevant stat then player A is the best when it's actually the reverse. He's the top scorer out of the 3 but that's about it regarding positives but is this the only relevant stat?

Which player do you think has the best mins per goal?
Player A gets a goal every 263 mins yet Player B gets a goal every 228 mins and Player C gets a goal every 190 mins! Scale them up and player B should get 15 goals if he was lone striker all season but still got the same mins per goal stat. Player C could get 18 which is actually better than the 13 goals from player A. Remember I said equal fitness/stamina so players B and C could last 90 mins but they have to share the role for Team 2.

An example of misleading goals in a season/appearances per goal being Fletcher in 2012-13 season as mentioned above. Aye it's class he got 11 goals but he needed 85 mins per appearance to get them. What you are saying is that if Defoe scored just 10 goals with 62 mins per appearance then this isn't as good. Yet if Defoe did play an average of 85 mins per appearance and maintained his average of a goal every 182 mins then he'd score 15 goals.

Many will also simply remember the basic stat that Altidore got 1 goal in 42 appearances and disregard the fact he only played an average of 50 mins per appearance. It's f***ing shit no matter how you look at it but not as shit. Same goes for Wickham as he's only on 56 mins per appearance whereas Fletcher is on 75 mins per appearance for SAFC so Fletcher has had 20 mins more per appearance yet some will still compare them on goals per appearance ;).

Defoe has got his all his League goals with an average appearance of just 62 mins so that theoretically leaves 28 minutes for another striker to score more goals to add to the tally of goals contributed from that number 10 shirt. If we could hoy Chicharito on for those last 28 mins and maybe now you can see my point about the minutes per goal being the most important stat of all.

Now go back to Bent, I didn't know he averaged about 88 minutes per appearance for his 58 league games! He scored 32 goals and got a goal every 161 minutes but isn't being on the pitch the whole game going to mean more chances to score? Did we have a better team overall back them creating more chances per game than we do now? Even so Defoe isn't that far behind and that's in many subbed games which IMO means he may have missed out on the extra chances that fell to whoever was in his place. Defoe only scored 10 goals in 2001-02 but strangely enough he averaged a goal every 161 mins also as he was only on the pitch 46 mins for his 35 appearances.

So the big question is, how much time will Defoe get on the pitch for the rest of the season? If he somehow spends an average of 85 mins like Fletcher did in his 1st season here then surely due to Defoe's past record of mins per goal, he'll hopefully give a higher goal return than he would if he only average 62 mins per appearance? Whatever it is, I certainly won't be judging him simply on how many goals he scores this season, or even how many goals he scores in X amount of appearances but simply how many pitch minutes it takes him to score a goal on average.

Some canny players stats here for those who look a little past the goals per season/appearances per goal stats.

Wickham
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Fletcher
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Altidore
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Defoe
Bent

p.s. ignore the post as I'm just waffling on anyway seeing as I love stats and @Statto Junkie is just an imposter :lol:
Click to expand...
Holy fuckin moley! :eek:
 
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