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Trott/Ali

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johnson

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200 plus for the Lions

He will be back in no doubt, and looking forward to having him back, now his head is sorted, an absolute rock, and someone the Aussies a fearful of

Saw this on twitter and wondered what people thought.

Most assuming Trott will open with Cook, and I would be up for that, but would be nice to have an aggressive player next to Cook.

How about Ali up there, he hasn't exactly been a success at 6, and I think he could be someone who could get away when the new ball is still hard, allowing Trott to slip in middle order.
 

I like Mo but he is susceptible to the short ball, which he would face a lot more of in test cricket.

You could also be asking him to open after bowling all day. Not been many successful opener-all-rounders over the years.
 
Ali is not an opener in the longer form of the game and I thought he'd done ok in the middle order. I've got a bad feeling about Trott tbh - very not sure but there's no one better suited and showing form at present the alternatives would be Lees/Lyth or you go to Carberry/Stoneman.

For preference as the England batting line-up is looking good apart from the openers I'd leave everything as it is and get someone new for the no 2 spot.
 
Bri said:
Ali is not an opener in the longer form of the game and I thought he'd done ok in the middle order. I've got a bad feeling about Trott tbh - very not sure but there's no one better suited and showing form at present the alternatives would be Lees/Lyth or you go to Carberry/Stoneman.

For preference as the England batting line-up is looking good apart from the openers I'd leave everything as it is and get someone new for the no 2 spot.
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Not convinced by Ali at 6

Trott is nailed on to play, he's an absolute class act

smoker said:
I like Mo but he is susceptible to the short ball, which he would face a lot more of in test cricket.

You could also be asking him to open after bowling all day. Not been many successful opener-all-rounders over the years.
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Very true, just think we need a bit more urgency at the top of the order, think he may be better when the ball is hard, rather than coming in at 6 against spin etc
 
the other prospect, who i wouldnt want to move from 5, is Root back to open, trott 3, bell 4 and ballance 5
 
I still have reservations about Trott if I am honest, although he probably deserves a go.

Aside from the well documented issues, I am not massively confident in his ability against the quicks. He has made loads of runs on wickets that resembled rolled snot at times, but when the Aussies got it right and bowled quickly at him, he didn't seem the keenest. Genuinely hope he comes good but worry that including him against the Aussies will immediately give them confidence.
 
Get Trott back in but the whole team and staff need to be more mindful of issues that all members of the team are facing, and be pro-active about it.
 
Carteron said:
I still have reservations about Trott if I am honest, although he probably deserves a go.

Aside from the well documented issues, I am not massively confident in his ability against the quicks. He has made loads of runs on wickets that resembled rolled snot at times, but when the Aussies got it right and bowled quickly at him, he didn't seem the keenest. Genuinely hope he comes good but worry that including him against the Aussies will immediately give them confidence.
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He scored a shit load in 2010/11 Ashes, and was in good touch last summer without converting.

I think he is an absolute class act

remember most test matches take place on flat pitches, he would of scored a shed load in Australia this summer, as India did.

Charmless Man said:
Get Trott back in but the whole team and staff need to be more mindful of issues that all members of the team are facing, and be pro-active about it.
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I agree, but the biggest problem I had was the reaction of the likes of vaughan. When he did his first interview saying he wanted to come back (before his 2nd breakdown), live on BBC radio Vaughan and Harmison were totally laying into him, saying what a poor interview it was etc.

That was an absolute disgrace, and something which could tip you over the edge depending on your mental state. Media have to realise how little things can affect people suffering with certain conditions and be more responsible about what they broadcast.
 
scotch said:
the other prospect, who i wouldnt want to move from 5, is Root back to open, trott 3, bell 4 and ballance 5
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are you saying you wouldn't move root to open or you would? (struggling a bit to follow that) It reads like you'd like to renumber the batting line up but that 'wouldnt' at the beginning suggests the opposite.

Personally I think we have batman looking good in the places they're are at the moment and scoring well so I don't see that would improve by shuffling the batting order and there would be a risk that things would worsen. The problem lies in the top of the order in the slots one and two solves the problems we have rather than attempt to solve them and risk creating problems elsewhere.
 
johnson said:
He scored a shit load in 2010/11 Ashes, and was in good touch last summer without converting.

I think he is an absolute class act

remember most test matches take place on flat pitches, he would of scored a shed load in Australia this summer, as India did.



I agree, but the biggest problem I had was the reaction of the likes of vaughan. When he did his first interview saying he wanted to come back (before his 2nd breakdown), live on BBC radio Vaughan and Harmison were totally laying into him, saying what a poor interview it was etc.

That was an absolute disgrace, and something which could tip you over the edge depending on your mental state. Media have to realise how little things can affect people suffering with certain conditions and be more responsible about what they broadcast.
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I haven't heard that but shocking if Harmison did say some insensitive things, given his well publicised struggles when on away tours.
 
Charmless Man said:
I haven't heard that but shocking if Harmison did say some insensitive things, given his well publicised struggles when on away tours.
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Basically Trott did a programme from Sky, and when trying to justify things said "I am not a nutter", but he was talking about the way he acts at the crease, scraping his pads, adjusting his pads etc


Vaughan and Harmy jumped on this, slating him for using that word and Harmy didn't seem to understand that there is no black and white with mental illness, because he wasn't suffering the same symptoms as he did, he wasn't suffering at all, just "tired" from too much cricket.

Was the closest I have come to calling into a radio show, nobody knows what goes through peoples minds, so its best not to guess IMO.
 
mikemanc said:
Wouldn't say it's back to normal at all.

Good to see Wood picking up a wicket before the close
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A score typical of his England form of the previous 2 years then, bloody pedant.

Good knocks by Lyth and Rashid, will have done their prospects no harm. Jonny Bairstow has been solid with bat so far this tour as well.
 
johnson said:
He scored a shit load in 2010/11 Ashes, and was in good touch last summer without converting.

I think he is an absolute class act

remember most test matches take place on flat pitches, he would of scored a shed load in Australia this summer, as India did.



I agree, but the biggest problem I had was the reaction of the likes of vaughan. When he did his first interview saying he wanted to come back (before his 2nd breakdown), live on BBC radio Vaughan and Harmison were totally laying into him, saying what a poor interview it was etc.

That was an absolute disgrace, and something which could tip you over the edge depending on your mental state. Media have to realise how little things can affect people suffering with certain conditions and be more responsible about what they broadcast.
Click to expand...
I dont doubt he has made runs but in 2010/11 the Aussie bowlers were all over the shop and pretty much everyone cashed in. Johnson was particularly erratic. Fast forward to the next visit when they got it right in terms of radar and he (albeit along with a few others) was massively found out.
 
Carteron said:
I dont doubt he has made runs but in 2010/11 the Aussie bowlers were all over the shop and pretty much everyone cashed in. Johnson was particularly erratic. Fast forward to the next visit when they got it right in terms of radar and he (albeit along with a few others) was massively found out.
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Found out? Ffs. He had a bad series, he is a top level international player and his stats prove it

It's like people saying cook has been "found out", easy to say after 26 international 100s
 
johnson said:
Found out? Ffs. He had a bad series, he is a top level international player and his stats prove it

It's like people saying cook has been "found out", easy to say after 26 international 100s
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As long as a player has a deficiency in his game and it is not rectified by remedial coaching they are 'found out' in my book. Cook got 'found out' with the angled delivery by Pakistan in 2010. Perhaps it is more pronounced when his confidence is low, perhaps it went away and came back but Australia were exploiting the same weakness in 2013/4. Sri Lanka were getting him out the same way last month.

I haven't seen much of Trott since the Ashes but he was well and truly 'found out' by anything at pace on leg stump: how many times was he out lbw, holing out at deep square leg or tickling a mistimed leg glance to Haddin? By all accounts he had put that right. Fast forward to Bloemfontein, Trott steps out to bat, South Africa A bring in a leg slip, bowl on his leg stump and within a couple of overs he's holed out there. Very worrying. Meanwhile, two 20 year olds slamming Lions bowling all round the park...

What the fuck is going on with England's coaching set up? Kohli got 'found out' by the swinging ball in England, within months he'd taken remedial action and scoring ton after ton in Australia....
 
Well I don't think Trott has done enough to warrant a recall. Granted a good half a season in the Championship but for me he's not proven his worth just yet. We don't even know what his mental state is like.

One thing that is certain is he shouldn't even be considered as an opener - we've got Adam Lyth waiting in the wings who scored 1500 runs at 67 last season and has also scored a ton on that Lions tour - it'd be a disgrace if he's ignored and Trott opens.

Will be yet another square peg, round hole decision by the England selectors.

smoker said:
What the fuck is going on with England's coaching set up? Kohli got 'found out' by the swinging ball in England, within months he'd taken remedial action and scoring ton after ton in Australia....
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.......Where it barely swings once the ball is about ten overs old.
 
brandon said:
Well I don't think Trott has done enough to warrant a recall. Granted a good half a season in the Championship but for me he's not proven his worth just yet. We don't even know what his mental state is like.

One thing that is certain is he shouldn't even be considered as an opener - we've got Adam Lyth waiting in the wings who scored 1500 runs at 67 last season and has also scored a ton on that Lions tour - it'd be a disgrace if he's ignored and Trott opens.

Will be yet another square peg, round hole decision by the England selectors.



.......Where it barely swings once the ball is about ten overs old.
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I think that is way over the top reaction, I'd have him straight back in the side as opener, the team is still fragile and I think Trott deserves another go, despite what people say, it takes great mental strength to tell the world you have a problem, he knew he would lose his place, maybe not get it back, and would have the world talking about him.

Lyth looks OK, but at this stage in the England side, with so many young players, I want another experience player in, and a world class one too.

smoker said:
As long as a player has a deficiency in his game and it is not rectified by remedial coaching they are 'found out' in my book. Cook got 'found out' with the angled delivery by Pakistan in 2010. Perhaps it is more pronounced when his confidence is low, perhaps it went away and came back but Australia were exploiting the same weakness in 2013/4. Sri Lanka were getting him out the same way last month.

I haven't seen much of Trott since the Ashes but he was well and truly 'found out' by anything at pace on leg stump: how many times was he out lbw, holing out at deep square leg or tickling a mistimed leg glance to Haddin? By all accounts he had put that right. Fast forward to Bloemfontein, Trott steps out to bat, South Africa A bring in a leg slip, bowl on his leg stump and within a couple of overs he's holed out there. Very worrying. Meanwhile, two 20 year olds slamming Lions bowling all round the park...

What the fuck is going on with England's coaching set up? Kohli got 'found out' by the swinging ball in England, within months he'd taken remedial action and scoring ton after ton in Australia....
Click to expand...

:) Ah OK, only took them 8500 test runs and 25 100s for him to be "found out", pity it took them that long to find him out ay?

Kohli took action? The ball didn't swing at all during this series, and the pitches were the flattest I have seen

If he was playing Jimmy in england next summer he would have the same problem, they all will, can't handle the moving ball. Flat track bullies.

But we all have different picks, no right or wrong answer, that is what crickets all about, lot of good players out there.
 
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