Advice on lifting

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A good simple beginners routine:

Day 1 - Pull
Deadlifts
BB rows
BB curls

Day 2 - Push
Incline/Flat DB or BB bench press
BB or DB shoulder press
Tricep dips/close grip bench press

Day 3 -Legs
Squats
BB Still leg deadlifts
Calf raises
Hanging leg raises
 


Stevie Freestein II said:
Yo Richie ....

Ta for that I might give it a go but isn't stronglifts 5x5 a lot easier for beginners? Not much to think about apart from learning good form which should happen when starting from a low base on squats, bench etc. and they add on 2.5kg per session.

Is working to failure (bold above) any better or worse than progressively adding more weight?

Cheers.
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Stronglifts is great, for mass and strength. But if you are wanting to craft your body then you must step it up a level. I put people further ahead of a beginners program as they ain't learning at a beginners levels as they are been trained with guidance the majority of the time. The 8-12 rep rule we use get people progressing much faster as you find the majority of people don't push themselves hard enough and get good results till they get experience. Everyone has a spotter on my program so I get them to push themselves to their limit. Training on your own this isn't always the best approach. But upping or lowering the weight by 5kg depending on how many reps you get (in the 8-12 range) is a good way to make sure they are lifting the correct weight.

@Charmless Man yeah I agree with what you say. Depending on who I've got in I'll set them the best program based on their size and experience in gym.

One thing I always make sure is there form is 100% correct, never sacrificing good form over heavy weight. It's all opinions though and that's what makes this forum good, and for us to learn from each other. All i know is what I'm teaching is working and most of the time I'm making my own rules up as I go along due to where i've failed myself in the past, and how to progress better. My failures over the last decade or the basis of my programme, making sure they don't do what i did! :lol:
 
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supersesh said:
Stronglifts is great, for mass and strength. But if you are wanting to craft your body then you must step it up a level. I put people further ahead of a beginners program as they ain't learning at a beginners levels as they are been trained with guidance the majority of the time. The 8-12 rep rule we use get people progressing much faster as you find the majority of people don't push themselves hard enough and get good results till they get experience. Everyone has a spotter on my program so I get them to push themselves to their limit. Training on your own this isn't always the best approach. But upping or lowering the weight by 5kg depending on how many reps you get (in the 8-12 range) is a good way to make sure they are lifting the correct weight.

@Charmless Man yeah I agree with what you say. Depending on who I've got in I'll set them the best program based on their size and experience in gym.

One thing I always make sure is there form is 100% correct, never sacrificing good form over heavy weight. It's all opinions though and that's what makes this forum good, and for us to learn from each other. All i know is what I'm teaching is working and most of the time I'm making my own rules up as I go along due to where i've failed myself in the past, and how to progress better. My failures over the last decade or the basis of my programme, making sure they don't do what i did! :lol:
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Should have said in my previous post 6 sets isn't especially abnormal.

jackynutmeg said:
A good simple beginners routine:

Day 1 - Pull
Deadlifts
BB rows
BB curls

Day 2 - Push
Incline/Flat DB or BB bench press
BB or DB shoulder press
Tricep dips/close grip bench press

Day 3 -Legs
Squats
BB Still leg deadlifts
Calf raises
Hanging leg raises
Click to expand...

Depending on what their volume looks like, most people can stand to squat relatively intensely three days a week. And I'd even argue they should!

This is one of those 'personal' experience things @supersesh was talking about: My legs don't seem to grow and my squat doesn't improve much unless I'm squatting 3 days a week.

Obviously squats are difficult, can be unpleasant and may put some people off like.
 
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supersesh said:
I teach people to follow the 8-12 rep rule.

example

Set 1
12 reps easy, go heavier
Set 2
12 reps easy , go heavier ( wouldn't even count these as as set if they were really easy)
Set 3 (set 1)
12 Reps, just managed. (stay same weight)
Set 4 (set 2)
10 reps, really tested you. (stay same weight)
Set 5 (set 3)
8 reps, really struggled (make weight lighter you're getting weaker each set)
Set 6 (set 4)
9 reps, really struggled (drop set if you want to finish yourself off :lol:

Explanation...

Now I know straight away some are thinking 6 sets!! Well this is for a novice been careful trying to find their weight. If you asses each set after you do it you can make sure your next set is your best set. remember you get weaker each set so thats why you make the decision based on how well you perform. Ideally you don't want to get 12 reps! if you struggled then you've found the right weight.

There are huge debates on what the best set/rep range is to follow over time you will find what works best for you. For now stick tot he 8-12 and it's a good way to learn you. I've learnt now everyones genes are different and some progress better with higher rep range, and some better with heavy lifting. This is why there is such a debate, and also add to the fact the majority typing most shit on the net are on gear and aren't really sure if it's there rep range getting good results or the gear ;)

For me personally, I don't get caught up too much on set and reps, I just concentrate on fkcuking the muscle up as much as possible, failure on every set, usually always finished by a drop set on the last set. For shoulder I do high reps and burn out, for back I like to go as heavy as possible, chest is all about the tempo. And abs is all about extreme weight. Again many say don't train to failure etc... over time you find out what works best for you.
Click to expand...

Last Friday I was in the gym I started with the overhead shoulder press I think it's called. I started with the 12kg dumbells. The problem I had was I could only manage 1 set of 8 reps and my arms failed (the left one anyway, I felt the right arm could have done a couple more)
As I went for a second set after a rest I found I couldn't lift all the way without failure. Should I maybes use 10kg or just keep trying with the 12kg.

Another daft question I have is when I'm working on my back 12kgs seem moderately simple to use. It seems I can lift more weight when working back muscles than when I'm doing shoulder or biceps/triceps.

So again the question would be is this normal and should I up and down the weight for certain excerises?

Cheers
 
Ward1973 said:
Last Friday I was in the gym I started with the overhead shoulder press I think it's called. I started with the 12kg dumbells. The problem I had was I could only manage 1 set of 8 reps and my arms failed (the left one anyway, I felt the right arm could have done a couple more)
As I went for a second set after a rest I found I couldn't lift all the way without failure. Should I maybes use 10kg or just keep trying with the 12kg.

Another daft question I have is when I'm working on my back 12kgs seem moderately simple to use. It seems I can lift more weight when working back muscles than when I'm doing shoulder or biceps/triceps.

So again the question would be is this normal and should I up and down the weight for certain excerises?

Cheers
Click to expand...

Most movements for training your back can be described as 'pulling' movements and yes, most people can pull more than they can push. It should be noted that you activate your biceps in a lot of pulling movements as well. But if you're isolating your biceps by doing curls or whatever then yes, you're going to lift far less weight because you're isolating a relatively tiny muscle rather than using them in tandem with a relatively large muscle like your lats (if you're doing rows).

The weight you use for each exercise shouldn't necessarily be the same weight. If you can squat twice what you can press then clearly you're short changing yourself if you only squat what you can press.
 
supersesh said:
I teach people to follow the 8-12 rep rule.

example

Set 1
12 reps easy, go heavier
Set 2
12 reps easy , go heavier ( wouldn't even count these as as set if they were really easy)
Set 3 (set 1)
12 Reps, just managed. (stay same weight)
Set 4 (set 2)
10 reps, really tested you. (stay same weight)
Set 5 (set 3)
8 reps, really struggled (make weight lighter you're getting weaker each set)
Set 6 (set 4)
9 reps, really struggled (drop set if you want to finish yourself off :lol:

Explanation...

Now I know straight away some are thinking 6 sets!! Well this is for a novice been careful trying to find their weight. If you asses each set after you do it you can make sure your next set is your best set. remember you get weaker each set so thats why you make the decision based on how well you perform. Ideally you don't want to get 12 reps! if you struggled then you've found the right weight.

There are huge debates on what the best set/rep range is to follow over time you will find what works best for you. For now stick tot he 8-12 and it's a good way to learn you. I've learnt now everyones genes are different and some progress better with higher rep range, and some better with heavy lifting. This is why there is such a debate, and also add to the fact the majority typing most shit on the net are on gear and aren't really sure if it's there rep range getting good results or the gear ;)

For me personally, I don't get caught up too much on set and reps, I just concentrate on fkcuking the muscle up as much as possible, failure on every set, usually always finished by a drop set on the last set. For shoulder I do high reps and burn out, for back I like to go as heavy as possible, chest is all about the tempo. And abs is all about extreme weight. Again many say don't train to failure etc... over time you find out what works best for you.
Click to expand...

Bit more info on the abs bit please? only work i do are crunches and planks so would like to know what else i should be doing. Ta.

Charmless Man said:
Obviously squats are difficult, can be unpleasant and may put some people off like.
Click to expand...

I love and loathe them in equal measures.

Ward1973 said:
Last Friday I was in the gym I started with the overhead shoulder press I think it's called. I started with the 12kg dumbells. The problem I had was I could only manage 1 set of 8 reps and my arms failed (the left one anyway, I felt the right arm could have done a couple more)
As I went for a second set after a rest I found I couldn't lift all the way without failure. Should I maybes use 10kg or just keep trying with the 12kg.
Click to expand...

Im no way an expert like some on here but id be dropping the weight to 10 until i could do 2 sets at least (and then fail to finish the third).
 
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supersesh said:
Add weight to your situps, you should not be able to complete more than 12 reps , if you can, add more weight :)
Click to expand...

I currently do 400 a night off the bounce with no weights at all :lol:

Edit: Ive got a four pack mind, but i reckon they are more the skinny boy type, that I now know dont count!
 
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